Hospital is fine. Patients are fine. Babies are fine. Parking lot could use some work.
As the sun rose over Gaza, fresh evidence of exactly what happened at the Al-Ahli Baptist Hospital has emerged, and it exposes perhaps the worst war-time disinformation campaign in modern history. Before we get there, though, it’s important to understand the timeline.
Rather, it was a live broadcast that occurred on Al Jazeera, and it included a timestamp on the chryon (i.e. no one can claim it was doctored). What the pro-Hamas network inadvertently showed was that at 6:59 PM, a rocket was fired from Gaza, exploded mid-air, and then fell down onto the hospital grounds.
By early Wednesday morning, more proof had emerged, including an intercepted conversation between jihadists admitting that a rocket had misfired near the hospital and caused the damage. . . Blah Blah Blah
It landed in the parking lot. Hospital’s just fine.
https://twitter.com/i/status/1714571497820307470
https://twitter.com/i/status/1714545680562184434
I wonder what would happen if we just didn’t react? We could, you know. We could assume it’s all BS and send them each a box of cookies for their trouble.
“The first casualty in war is the truth”.
I too, was horrified when I heard about the supposed bombing of the hospital. But so too, was a I horrified by the 40 babies who were decapitated. Really horrified on both counts.
Clearly, something happened. The 40 headless babies story has been quietly withdrawn. I saw something yesterday about the hospital, it said that it was the parking lot next door which was destroyed.
I’m going to withhold further comment until more information comes forth. (As a general rule, I tend to listen to Gail when it comes to breaking news. For one thing, she’s a workhouse when it comes to research; for another, she’s got that darn women’s intuition that I can’t fathom.)
I think during times like this we should trust our Orthodox Palestinian brothers and sisters who are suffering there. They know what it is like to live under Israel and Hammas. They are the ones caring for the injured and dying. They are suffering and dying as well for their homes. If our Orthodox brothers say it is Israel, then let us show some loyalty to them instead of the Zionist Evangelicals in the US. The Palestinian Orthodox are our brothers and our family. Blood is thicker than idealism.
Remember Russia. Remember Serbia. Remember Iraq. Remember Syria. Remember Ukraine. Remember Palestine. May God have mercy on us!
https://orderofsaintgeorge.org/urgent-update-gaza-18-october-2023/
Our Orthodox Palestinian brothers and sisters who are suffering have been suffering a very long time. And this isn’t a matter of “trust.” It’s a matter of truth and the truth will bear out.
Yes, “they are the ones caring for the injured and dying.” Their own injured and dying. Others are caring for the injured and dying on the other side.
God does not discriminate between the value of people. We are all precious in His sight. Neither Israel or Palestine is innocent and both are victims of the other.
So, my loyalties are not with either of them. This is not my war. I am not taking sides. I’m not going to let people petition others to take sides on this blog. Taking sides is what gets people into wars.
Hamas is not the enemy of the Palestinians as you’ve suggested. https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/hamas-cash-to-crypto-global-finance-maze-israels-sights-2023-10-16/
Hamas is their protector. Remember when Met. Philip used to say, “They’re not terrorists. They’re freedom fighters!” He was talking about the Lebanese Freedom Fighters, the PLO, and now Hamas. These terrorist go in there and take over the region. We send the Palestinians aid. The terrorists take their cut off the top and give the rest to the Palestinians. In return, they fight the Israelis for them.
After decades of being offered over a dozen peace treaties, the Palestinians continue to want to do things this way. It’s not the way I would do them, but hey, I don’t live there. It’s not my war.
Protect the innocent and teach the transgressors. That’s what I pray.
“After decades of being offered over a dozen peace treaties,
the Palestinians continue to want to do things this way. ”
As far as I am aware, none of the treaties they have been offered
would give them the status of a people with a land of their own.
It was not the Palestinians who rejected the two-state UN resolution,
just as it was not the Russians who rejected the Minsk Accords.
The Annapolis Conference (2007):
In 2007, Israeli Prime Minister Ehud Olmert and Palestinian Authority President Mahmoud Abbas, with the support of the U.S., launched the Annapolis Conference. The goal was to reach a peace agreement that would lead to the establishment of a Palestinian state. Hamas called for all parties to boycott the conference.
What Happened? Olmert said that he gave Abbas an “unprecedented offer” based on a return to the pre-1967 borders, including land swaps and a division of Jerusalem. But Olmert never received a final response from the Palestinians on the offer. A Palestinian negotiator subsequently acknowledged in the media that the Israeli plan would have given his side the equivalent of 100 percent of the disputed lands under discussion.
Very selective.
Even a brief read of the Wikipedia (known for its bias) article says that both sides were up in arms about this agreement, and the Israeli coalition government almost fell apart because of the disagreements that arose.
I wasn’t asked to do an analysis, Jack. I was asked to refresh someone’s recollection.
January 24, 2006 | Address by Acting PM
Ehud Olmert to the 6th Herzliya Conference:
https://web.archive.org/web/20100613161207/http://israelemb.org/articles/2006/January/2006012601.htm
‘ The existence of a Jewish majority in the State of Israel cannot be maintained with the continued control over the Palestinian population in Judea, Samaria and the Gaza Strip. We firmly stand by the historic right of the people of Israel to the entire Land of Israel. Every hill in Samaria and every valley in Judea is part of our historic homeland. We do not forget this, not even for one moment. However, the choice between the desire to allow every Jew to live anywhere in the Land of Israel to the existence of the State of Israel as a Jewish country – obligates relinquishing parts of the Land of Israel. This is not a relinquishing of the Zionist idea, rather the essential realization of the Zionist goal – ensuring the existence of a Jewish and democratic state in the Land of Israel.
In order to ensure the existence of a Jewish national homeland, we will not be able to continue ruling over the territories in which the majority of the Palestinian population lives. We must create a clear boundary as soon as possible, one which will reflect the demographic reality on the ground. Israel will maintain control over the security zones, the Jewish settlement blocs, and those places which have supreme national importance to the Jewish people, first and foremost a united Jerusalem under Israeli sovereignty. There can be no Jewish state without the capital of Jerusalem at its center. ‘
The listed qualifications suggest the offer was based on policy,
not on principle; and policies can change with circumstances.
And, it seems, East Jerusalem was not to be for the Arabs…
And here is Netanyahu demonstrating
his credentials as an honest negotiator:
Tricky Netanyahu: I Deceived the US to
Destroy Oslo Accords | English Subtitles
https://www.brighteon.com/733ac632-e898-4257-87cb-99c9f5a48292
[Video -5:43]
There’s a popular saying spoken by those who have tried to work with the Palestinians: “The Palestinians never lose an opportunity to lose an opportunity”.
Having said that, it does look like the hospital was bombed (perhaps accidentally by the Israelis). This according to Larry Johnson:
https://sonar21.com/after-weighing-the-evidence-israel-appears-responsible-for-the-bombing-of-the-al-ahli-hospital/
Yeah, I’m not saying either side are not difficult. And part of me wants to throw up my hands and say, “Just arm both sides and ignore them.”
However, there are Christians caught in the middle. Moreover, the region is oil producing. But, once again, it is just two tribes of brutal heathen, hell bent on exterminating each other. They just picked the wrong place to do it.
Why should the Palestinians, who owned all the land until 80 years ago, have to settle for half of it just because some colonists want it? If they are willing to fight for all of it, they should continue to do so.
Of course I’m sure it wasn’t offered in good faith anyway, considering how the West Bank has been consumed by settlers.
AS,
Well, that’s fundamentally the problem, isn’t it? There were, of course, Jews there for centuries, but not in the numbers that flooded in after the war. Then there was a huge transfer of populations, partially driven by ethnic cleansing, around the establishment of Israel.
Now we have two distinct populations, perhaps three if you distinguish the Arab Christians. And they’re there. Dug in.
My resolution would be to forge a two state solution as a modus vivendi to establish two separate self ruled nations. Demography would likely do the rest. Moreover, there is nothing preventing the Palestinians from using their newly created state as a base to continue the struggle against Israel.
If the Israelis ever get uncomfortable enough, and they might, they will leave.
The Zionists believe God, Himself, gave them that land. I can’t see them leaving. (I shouldn’t have said Israelis.)
Well, Galinushka, I’m trying to stay neutral but it has probably sounded like I’m pro-Palestinian. What I seek to maintain is the Russian evenhandedness necessary to broker some solution when the United States fails and the boo boo hits the fan for real.
In that regard, it is necessary to take account of the Arab position and not to twist objective reality in order to suit America and Israel. Are both sides gangsters? Most certainly. But peace is better nonetheless. And neither is just going to pack up and leave tomorrow morning. But hope should not be extinguished either.
Now, it just so happens that objective reality cuts hard against Hamas, but also cuts hard against the IDF. And the geopolitical situation is quite perilous. Here’s a string of things that could happen which would leave everyone on edge:
Israel moves into Gaza. Hezbollah attacks from the north into Israel threatening to take some part of Northern Israel. The US intervenes and begins striking Hezbollah with the two carrier groups we have in the region. Either Syria intervenes as well or we or Israel attack Syria and perhaps Iran. Iran prepares to intervene as well as Egypt. The carrier groups begin attacking Syria and threaten Assad’s government there. Russian MiG-31’s launch Kinzhal missiles, sinking one or both carriers. Turkey sends a two million man army into Israel.
Absent the use of nukes, Israel loses. But Pakistan has already said that it will assist other Muslim states in the regions with nukes if necessary and Iran could assemble a nuke in very short order. So even the use of nukes might not save Israel.
So it could easily get unspeakably bloody in very short order.
No! Not at all. It sounds like you think Israel is going to disappear because you see this war as more far reaching than I do, e.g. If A moves here, and B moves there, while C moves into D’s territory, X will occur. Yes, that could get very bloody.
I, however, think the following:
1) This has nothing to do with Hamas, Iran, Hezbollah, or Lebanon; they are props
2) Egypt, Iran, Saudi Arabia, and the United Arab Emirates (Turkey and Syria because of Russia) have EVERYTHING to lose if there is a war like you’re describing. They won’t be allowed into BRICS.
3) The State of Israel is not the target; The target is a small, well protected group of people who tried to depopulate the planet
5) They are smoking them out by crashing their currency (all that money we’re giving them is fiat money worth nothing since the Federal Reserve went bankrupt)
6) China is refusing to give them loans; the Rothchild’s are having fire sales, and Soros is selling off 40% of its holdings
This “war” was a distraction to accomplish the following:
1) Go into Israel and round up the small group of people up who wanted to rid the planet of human beings
2) Allow China to take Taiwan
3) Allow Russian to finish with Ukraine
4) Establish a multipolar world through BRICS (which used to be called The Alliance, of which Trump was a part, ensuring we’ll have a seat at the table when Trump returns)
5) The State of Israel??? May collapse. Depends on them.
The reason Biden conflates Russia and Hamas is that he understands that he is in a war for global hegemony with Russia/China. Neither side has any incentive to back down and every incentive to prevail because they’re playing for all the marbles. Thus, the above scenario is entirely plausible. Erdogan is interested in reviving the Ottoman Empire and he might very well see this as a golden opportunity, given his age.
The only silver lining I see is that Putin and Xi are less clumsy and more nuanced than the US or Europe. The real question is whether they can finesse this without it blowing up.
To George:
The AP just posted this (10/21/23) and they’ve done quite a bit of analysis:
AP visual analysis: Rocket from Gaza appeared to go astray, likely caused deadly hospital explosion
Excerpt: The AP analyzed more than a dozen videos from the moments before, during and after the hospital explosion, as well as satellite imagery and photos. AP’s analysis shows that the rocket that broke up in the air was fired from within Palestinian territory, and that the hospital explosion was most likely caused when part of that rocket crashed to the ground. . .
https://apnews.com/article/israel-palestinians-hamas-war-hospital-rocket-gaza-e0fa550faa4678f024797b72132452e3?taid=653359761b640e00010945be&utm_campaign=TrueAnthem&utm_medium=AP&utm_source=Twitter
And if you think an attack might happen, you might want to look at the place where all the soldiers are: https://twitter.com/robertdunlap947/status/1715830891040117047?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1715830891040117047%7Ctwgr%5E121812e995e1923659fd3b2bc5cb420fdb7982f4%7Ctwcon%5Es1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fbeforeitsnews.com%2Fopinion-conservative%2F2023%2F10%2Fis-washington-expecting-an-attack-3676040.html
Personally, I agree with you regarding Putin. He’s the only one who’s acted like a grownup in this situation. If there’s any hope for a peaceful resolution, it’s going to be brokered by Russia.
Unfortunately, neither Biden nor Netanyahu have any incentive to come to the table to talk. Both are scandal-plagued –Netanyahu so much so that he risks very real jail time should his fragile coalition collapse–that this war is a godsend to them.
Ironically, Israel runs the risk of a real civil war because of the differing demographics, one side to which Netanyahu hitched his wagon to. As for the US, I’m afraid that our staggering debt is going to cause a massive societal collapse. We are already seeing the strains of our coming apart on the Left alone, what with the real Left (Tlaib, Omar, Hamas sympathizers) going after the neoliberals (Harvard, Unipartyists, etc.)
Hell, even Hollywood is tearing itself apart on this issue alone.
Then there’s the fact that the President of a Detroit synagogue was just stabbed to death this morning. And Minister Farrakhan suing the ADL for $5 billion.
The cherry on top of all this is that the Right can’t get its act together to elect a Speaker.
I’m not taking sides, either. And if anyone is to blame, it is the West who decided to create the state of Israel in the middle of an ancient, settled land of 1.2 million people, 800,000 of whom were driven out of their homes and villages at gunpoint by the Israeli army so Israelis could move in, many murdered or dying in the process.
I mean, I feel for what the Jewish people went through in the Holocaust. But the West’s misguided choice of location for a Jewish homeland, partly under the influence of Christian Zionists (along with Zionist Jews), created a multigenerational blood feud between Jew and Muslim that has only gotten worse as Jewish Zionism has taken control in Israel – and which not even all Jews support. Plenty of Jewish people want peace, too, and don’t want to kill all Palestinians to get it.
What they need is Christ, His healing grace and forgiveness, and the grace to forgive each other. And we all need to repent of all this sin. That is my prayer.
In the meantime, a good Orthodox priest I follow on TwitterX posted this the other day, and I agree completely: “I love the Palestinians. I love the Jews. I love the Arabs. I love the Persians. I love Americans. I love Russians. I love Ukrainians. I am commanded to love everyone, in gratitude to the God who loves us all. We don’t need revenge. We need God’s mercy. We need to repent.” – @FrGeorgedeIdaho
Wise words from that priest!
Fr. George (my pastor) hitting the bullseye, as he usually does…
Hamas is their elected government, so when people say things like “Hamas stole the medical supplies” or “Hamas takes their cut first” it actually doesn’t make sense, as they are operating like any state authority would in such matters. The terrorists in Washington DC take their cut off the top of my paycheck and yours and bomb children with it, for that matter.
I agree it’s not our fight, but America’s full weight is on the scale on Israel’s side, so it’s right to at least create some pressure against America’s involvement. Without which Israel would fall within a week.
RE: “America’s full weight is on the scale on Israel’s side.”
When you think about it, what difference does it make what we believe in America? We are no longer the player that we used to be.
Yes, exactly.
America is sleepwalking into a monumental disaster, or, more accurately, a series of monumental disasters. And not only the American Establishment but the American people deserve it.
America is leading the West into a world war with the Rest of humanity, the 85%, which the Rest, led by the Sino-Russian Alliance, are going to win. It is due to a combination of good leadership on the part of the Russians and Chinese and simply incompetent leadership in the West. The Western Establishment realizes that something is wrong and that they are in danger of losing their empire, but they have no idea how to stop the bleeding.
It induces schadenfreude in many of us despite the bloody nature of the debacles leading to Western decline. We are witnessing the rise of the Eurasian Century. It appears that the Sino-Russian Alliance, or Eurasian Alliance, will be taking the lead in East Asia, Eastern (and possibly all of) Europe, the Middle East and Africa. China’s Belt and Road Initiative is part of the strategy. Russia’s geostrategic intrigues are another part.
The Rest of the world is taking sides and the West is coming up short. The war will last some time, but it grows more clear each day that the center of power has moved East and that the conflict becomes more of a mismatch as time passes.
So be it.
I can’t imagine America waking up to become savvy enough to lead the world with enough wisdom to avoid perpetual wars and cataclysms. We are a nation divided and a region (the West) divided and until we get our issues resolved we are a danger to ourselves and everyone else.
Large part of me looks forward to this collapse. Who knows what’ll look like a year much less 10 years from now, and though it won’t be without hardship, I pray it’ll be better.
Even MAGA is blind on Israel. There is simply no real faction in the US “getting it right” on most serious issues. But that is what you’d expect from a declining power starting its tailspin into a hard landing. Rational, well-informed, wise voices would be able to gain traction and work to right the ship, so to speak (to mix metaphors).
This is why it eerily is taking on the air of the French Revolution or Birth of the Planet of the Apes. There is simply no internal rational voice sufficiently strong to counter the self-destructive soup of ideologies dragging the empire down the crapper. “Whom the gods would destroy they first drive mad.”
The collapse of America’s overseas empire will not be pretty. Then again, neither is the present state of affairs.
Biden, in less than one term has collapsed America’s economy, inflated the currency, and driven us to the precipice of WWIII.
But hey! No mean tweets! Amiright?
Hamas once was their elected government…but it’s said that they haven’t had elections since 2006. And even then, Hamas did not get a majority of the votes cast.
One man, one vote…once.
Ray McGovern has concluded the same as everyone else I trust among analysts.
Ben David, this thing in the Holy Land is a royal mess. You bring up a good point about the ZioChristians. What a heresy. I need to write about it.
The Middle East where Muslims and Israelis shoot at each other with the Christians in the crossfire. I will support the Christians in the Middle East until my dying breath and pray for peace until the end. Satan is definitely working behind the scenes on this one. Using two enemies who do not know God kill each other while doing damage to Christians at the same time.
Lord have Mercy
Two peoples who are at war claiming to believe in God and neither side knows who God is
Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.
If ye had known me, ye should have known my Father also: and from henceforth ye know him, and have seen him.
John 14:6-7
But I’m not going to be worried
And ye shall hear of wars and rumours of wars: see that ye be not troubled: for all these things must come to pass, but the end is not yet.
For nation shall rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom: and there shall be famines, and pestilences, and earthquakes, in divers places.
Matthew 24:6-7
And
Let not your heart be troubled: ye believe in God, believe also in me.
John 14:1
Here’s an analysis about the alleged hospital bombing by Larry Johnson (who is no pro-Israeli shill, btw):
https://sonar21.com/many-unanswered-questions-surrounding-alleged-israeli-bombing-of-baptist-hospital-in-the-gaza-strip/
Alex Christoforou is intrepid and has a handle on it:
Reality.
Also, Brian Berletic at 13:45 or so. “Almost certainly Israeli . . .”
JDAM possibly?:
https://www.dailysabah.com/world/mid-east/experts-refute-israels-claims-on-gaza-hospital-attack
It was a missile launched by an aircraft, so it was Israeli. You can hear the afterburners. It’s all on video and geo-confirmed by the New York Times of all places. It didn’t leave a crater because it was an air burst. It was up to a 2000 pound bomb.
I don’t think I would trust @Osinttechnical, looks like a NATO shill to me.
The media started out reporting Gaza officials claimed it was an Israeli missile attack. That “claimed” language is a signal to the Zionist media that they don’t have a cover story and someone better come up with one fast. And yeah, a conveniently recorded phone conversation… right. After Hamas has been doing everything with no digital footprint. It would take the Mossad 10 seconds to make a “phone conversation.”
They ask us to believe that Hamas launched by far the most powerful missile they’ve ever used—when they mostly use homemade unguided rockets—and had the bad luck of hitting their own territory with it? I say B as in B and S as in S…
But these people think the bombing of civilians in Dresden and Hiroshima were also justified.
Sheer and utter nonsense. It was clearly a misfired rocket by Palestinian terrorists. All of the evidence supports that truth. The hospital wasn’t bombed, it was a parking lot. Hospital is standing. There is no evidence that 500 died beyond the Hamas lies and propaganda said. Approximately 140 innocent people died due to insanity of terrorists.
https://thelibertydaily.com/entire-500-killed-after-israel-bombed-hospital-narrative/
https://nypost.com/2023/10/17/israel-hamas-war-live-updates-and-latest-news/
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-12644477/Israels-evidence-hospital-bloodbath-caused-misfired-rocket-Gaza-terrorists-IDF-claims-satellite-photos-footage-wiretapped-phone-call-prove-isnt-blame-horror.html
https://nypost.com/2023/10/18/idf-releases-audio-of-terrorists-admitting-they-fired-at-hospital/
Thank you for your service in repeating the official narrative that is now in place.
https://twitter.com/Partisangirl/status/1714735570889691297
https://www.tiktok.com/@dodge_diaries/video/7291215006635429163
https://normanfinkelstein.substack.com/p/how-can-anyone-trust-the-israeli
https://normanfinkelstein.substack.com/p/israel-would-never-target-medical
https://stateofthenation.co/?p=191888
https://rumble.com/v3q02vm-october-17-2023.html
https://rumble.com/v3ouftq-the-three-biggest-lies-theyre-spreading-right-now.html
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hhnw0BfTNr8
Lied about beheaded babies,
Lied about USS Liberty,
Lied about Covid,
Lied about the vaccine,
Lied about Russiagate,
Lied about Hunter’s laptop,
Lied about the Nord Stream pipeline,
But now they’re telling the truth…
“You want the truth?! You can’t handle the truth!”
As my grandmother used to say, “If I can’t see it, touch it, or feel it, forget it.”
It’s been my experience that most people believe what they need/want to believe… i.e., they believe whatever “facts” they can find to support the worldview that they find most comfortable.
Saw this with COVID. We see this all the time with the side show that is American government and politics. We see it with this Israeli/Palestinian mess that’s been ongoing for decades. The “side” that people choose is usually a result of what they need/want to believe.
God, of course, doesn’t take sides. God’s response is probably tears at the mess that we the people are making on earth. God loves Palestinian and Israeli children (and adults) the same.
But what academic lunatics thought it was a good idea to create an Israeli state in the middle of an Islamic sea 80 years ago? I’ve known some wonderful Muslim people, but Samuel Huntington was correct in “Clash of Civilizations” when he wrote that “Islam has bloody borders.” Heck, any Orthodox Christian who’s familiar with Christian history could have told you that….
It would have been far less bloody long-term to carve out a state for the Jewish people in the South of France.
Seems to me that Israel’s days are numbered, since it can only blast so many people to smithereens before the Islamic sea around it rises up in retaliation. American support is pretty much meaningless anymore — the world (and the American military) are not as they were in 1985.
As Alexander Mercouris pointed out, the train has already left the station. It might have been possible to convince the Arab and Muslim world that it was a misfired Islamic Jihad rocket if the Israelis had allowed an independent investigation under the auspices of the UN.
They did not.
Absent that, the Muslim world is going to believe that the party which is currently indiscriminately bombing Gaza also bombed the hospital.
It’s a done deal.
Now, the West can rationalize it and drive the story into remission, as they would say in Wag The Dog. But it doesn’t matter. Most Westerners would still support Israel even if they believed that it targeted the hospital as a Hamas harbor, regardless of whether it was or not. Remember, originally the Israelis owned up to it but, after some negative blowback, concocted a series of band aids, most of which have been debunked, to stop the bleeding. The Arab story has been consistent from the beginning.
Without an independent investigation, the entire Arab and Muslim world will believe it was IDF murdering wounded civilians. That’s the reality of what has transpired. Don’t believe me? Ask President Biden how his little summit with the Arab leaders went. Oh, wait, I forgot. They cancelled it. A meeting with the President of the United States.
It’s baked in the cake now.
Norman Finkelstein summed it all up years ago:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Norman_Finkelstein#/media/File:Norman_Finkelstein_says_by_Latuff2.jpg
It’s becoming the conventional wisdom on the right that it was a hoax spread by Hamas. It reminds me of Bucha. Truly, it is the Empire of Lies. It is not often I find myself agreeing with Rashida Tlaib.
The whole thing has to come down. Trump can’t make a dent in this. He’s cheering on Israel. But I believe it will come down. The media has changed everything. It is much harder to hide the truth indefinitely.
I mean, the Republican base is Zionist Boomers so I’m not surprised the right has bought into the Mossad narrative.
Huh????
My family is full of them, they drink it like water. Believe me. They buy and repeat every lie Netanyahu says.
I can’t speak for your family but even his own people don’t want him and most of us are very aware of his (what should I call them????) “limitations”.
Christian Zionists, big in the Evangelical world. They literally believe the restoration of Israel will lead to the second coming of Christ, so they support Israel. The movement has been around for decades, really grown and directly influences US policy toward Israel.
I think they already have everything ready for the new temple. The furnishings, the people, even the red calf.
They have a strange logic, these Christian Zionists.
They support the expansion of Zionist Israel
in the hope that (in his Second Coming,
precipitated by the said expansion)
the Lord will waste the Jews.
Allies they may be.
Friends they are not.
That Christ will waste the Jews at His coming is not what Christian Zionists believe. On the contrary, they believe that the Jews will finally recognize their Messiah and that “all Israel will be saved” (Romans).
It is wrong, of course, and has had devastating consequences over the years. But more than that, it is a doctrine demonically designed to prepare them for the ultimate deception of the Anti-Christ himself.
Brian is right.
Brian, the more I think about John Hagee and his heretical cult, the angrier I get. It’s as if he’s an American ayatollah, one willing to sacrifice the blood and and treasure of millions of young Americans on the altar of his false religion.
Me too, George. And it’s not just Hagee, though he’s the most influential one. I was Evangelical for a few years in the late 90s, after my initial conversion to Christ. Christian Zionism was around then, I heard about it, but it was not predominant, and I didn’t know much.
Sadly, in the years since I moved on from there, not only has Christian Zionism grown massively, but the entire Evangelical world seems to have been overcome with a strong spirit of delusion, speaking in “tongues,” seeking visions and locutions (direct messages from the Lord), and prophecies regarding the times we’re in and the end times. I have friends and family members caught up in it and it is seriously delusional, the stuff I’ve seen. Some of it has entered into the Catholic Church, too, I was very dismayed after years of teaching there to find some of it had even entered into seminary formation of priests across the country and being promoted by bishops. I was glad to leave that behind when I became Orthodox.
But I did not know about the direct role it plays in forming US policy, until last week when this latest Israel/Hamas conflict broke out and I really started to look at it. And it makes me burn with anger. It is spiritual delusion, billions of our taxpayer dollars are going to support it and brought us to the brink of another world war.
But, God allows and even sends a strong delusion on people, to get people to turn from sin or to punish them if they don’t. And I am very worried this is happening now, it is frightening all the things that are happening, and not just Israel.
I had already turned from politics for any real solution, have been politically disaffiliated for a while. But this complex disaster of the present world is causing me to turn even more firmly to Christ, the only real answer and solution, and hang onto Him regardless of what may come.
Maybe there’s hope.
There’s a wonderful OCA priest and military chaplain whose dad is or was on ministry staff at Hagee’s Cornerstone.
God has a way of showing up (often in mysterious ways) where He needs to be.
I expect Hagee got the ‘cornerstone’ name
for his church from Matt 21:42 [KJV]
Jesus saith unto them,
Did ye never read in the scriptures,
The stone which the builders rejected,
the same is become the head of the corner:
this is the Lord’s doing,
and it is marvellous in our eyes?
The following three verses [KJV] read:
43Therefore say I unto you,
The kingdom of God shall be taken from you,
and given to a nation bringing forth the fruits thereof.
44And whosoever shall fall on this stone shall be broken:
but on whomsoever it shall fall,
it will grind him to powder.
45And when the chief priests and Pharisees had heard his parables, they perceived that he spake of them.
Rabbinic Judaism is the successor to Pharisaic Judaism.
Perhaps Hagee’s extreme theology springs from here.
“That Christ will waste the Jews at His coming
is not what Christian Zionists believe.”
There are, I think, those that do.
Brendan,
Why not write something to prove your position? I feel like one has accept what you say (by letting it rest) because it’s what you “think” or what you “recall” or do the research to prove you wrong which you often won’t accept.
I’m thinking if YOU did the research to support your position, we might make more progress.
What makes you “think” there are Christian Zionist who believe Christ will waste them at the end of days?
CUFI Leader John Hagee confirms
Christian Zionism is anti-Semitic
https://mondoweiss.net/2015/03/confirms-christian-semitic/
‘ Evangelical pastor John Hagee, the leader of Christians United for Israel (CUFI), the US’ largest pro-Israel organization and the most powerful group in the Christian Zionist movement, has adamantly insisted that Christian Zionism is anti-Semitic.
WorldNetDaily (WND), a far-right website published an article in March 2015 about the “Blood Moon Prophecy,” an end-of-times theory that lunar eclipses are a sign that the world is on the brink of destruction and that the Second Coming of Jesus Christ is near. The lengthy piece is about Hagee’s film Four Blood Moons, which endorses the eschatological theory. Toward the end of the article, WND quotes a spokesperson for Hagee:
“WND falsely claimed that Hagee does not believe that Jews need Jesus to be saved. In fact, Hagee never made such a claim and years ago directly denied assertions that he holds a dual-covenant theology,” he wrote. “In addition, while WND acknowledges that Hagee rewrote sections of ‘In Defense of Israel’ to clarify his relevant position, WND failed to note that the associated video promotion was also changed to accurately reflect his theology.”
Translated: WND claimed that Hagee believed the Jewish people could be saved by God without abandoning Judaism and converting to Christianity. Apocalyptic Christian Zionist John Hagee censured the publication for spreading a lie and defensively clarified that he does indeed believe that the Jewish people are going to burn in Hell for all of eternity unless they abandon Judaism and convert to Christianity.
In short, Hagee firmly insisted that Christian Zionism is anti-Semitic, and that the reason CUFI so obsessively and blindly defends Israel is not because they care about Jews (who, in their mind, will face eternal damnation unless they renounce their religion and become Christians) but rather because they genuinely believe the world is on the verge of total annihilation and the Bible supposedly tells them they must do so.
Christian Zionism
Christian Zionism is the belief that God gave the Jewish people the land of Israel in historic Palestine. Christian Zionists hold that this is part of a biblical prophecy, and is a necessary prerequisite before the Second Coming of Jesus Christ and the ensuing Day of Judgment.
This is not a view shared by all Christians, yet is very common among Evangelicals and conservative Protestants. In recent years, it has gained prominence in the US, particularly in the Bible Belt. A late 2013 Pew Research study found 82% of white evangelical Christians in the US believed God gave the land of Israel to the Jewish people, while only 40% of US Jews believed the same.
John Hagee is the leader of CUFI, the most powerful Christian Zionist organization in the US, and likely in the entire world.
Some Jewish and Zionist organizations have criticized Hagee and the Christian Zionist movement. Eric Yoffie, former president of the Union for Reform Judaism, publicly proclaimed that, vis-à-vis “Israeli-Palestinian politics, John Hagee and the CUFI are extremists.” Yoffie “called for Reform congregations to not participate in CUFI’s events and to continue to call for public condemnation of inflammatory and bigoted statements from Christian Zionist leadership.”
Many Jewish and Zionist organizations, however, see Hagee and CUFI as important allies. At the CUFI 2013 Summit, Malcolm Hoenlein, executive vice chairman of the Conference of Presidents of Major American Jewish Organizations—a coalition of 51 US Jewish groups, including some of the most prominent—voiced support of biblical Christian Zionist prophecies. “The prophets were not prophets of doom but prophets of hope; you just have to read it right,” he told them. “Here’s my advice: Don’t bet against the Jews. And the ‘Jewish lobby’ is a myth, but it’s our job to make it a legend.”
Israel itself has been more than happy to support CUFI. Ron Dermer, Israeli Ambassador to the US, spoke glowingly of the organization at its 2014 summit. Prime Minister Netanyahu has also enthusiastically supported the group, and has spoken at several of their annual summits.
Hagee’s History of Extreme Views
Hagee, who thinks we are the last generation of humans, is no stranger to controversy. In late 2014, he claimed that Ebola (along with the civil rights protests in Ferguson and elsewhere) was God’s way of “punishing” America, because Obama was trying to “divide” Israel.
The pastor has even gone so far as to essentially defend Adolf Hitler. In a 2005 sermon, Hagee asserted that God sent Hitler as a “hunter,” in order to “hunt them [Jews] from every mountain and from every hill and out of the holes of the rocks … to get them to come back to the land of Israel.”
Once again, these are the views of the leader of, in CUFI’s own words, “the largest pro-Israel organization in the United States with over two million members and one of the leading Christian grassroots movements in the world.”
The Washington Post indicates that CUFI “can boast that it has members from every congressional district in America.” Foreign Policy included John Hagee in its list of the 50 Republicans with the most influence on foreign policy. The evangelical Christian Zionist was a much sought-after figure by the Republican Party in the 2008 presidential election. He ended up endorsing John McCain.
WND’s founder and CEO Joseph Farah responded positively to Hagee’s firm insistence on his Christianity-rooted anti-Semitism. “I’m happy to hear that Hagee no longer subscribes to those anti-biblical positions,” he said. “But we never asserted what Hagee believes, only what he said on videotape. I’m gratified he has repudiated all of that. It’s time for him to clean up another mess.”
Like Hagee, Farah resolutely maintains that Christian Zionism is, in its very essence, an anti-Semitic ideology, as, in his view, it is an “anti-biblical position” to claim that Jews are not automatically damned to eternal suffering in a lake of fire merely by virtue of their being Jewish. ‘
Don’t bother writing anything on my account, Brendan. For all I know there could be a sect of a sect of the sect of Christian Zionists that teach/believe such a thing. Nothing personal against anyone, but popular Evangelical doctrine is a moving target I don’t care to chase.
Yes, exactly – these are the people who comprise America’s political elite – nearly all Zionists, who firmly believe that any behavior by Israel needs to be excused/justified/rationalized, and that America must support Israel at all costs, or something.
Some of it is generational – among Boomers, the Zionist support is very high, more than 80%. Some of this may have to do with that they are within living memory of parents who fought in WW2 and the ghastly Holocaust. Some of this may also have to do with the fact that before 20-30 years ago, it was fairly rare for Americans to have contact with Middle Easterners who were not Israeli. Most older “white people” in America definitely have Jewish friends… far fewer have non-Jewish Middle Eastern or Muslim friends.
With younger generations, things are definitely different. Young people are not reflexively “Israel can do no wrong.” One of the effects of immigration over the past 20-30 years is that younger people are coming into contact more and more with Middle Easterners whose families and lives have been significantly hurt and affected by bad Israeli policy.
God loves everyone just the same – Christian Zionists need to remember that God loves Palestinians just as much as He loves Jews. This is a terrible mess and I wish the war would stop yesterday. But I am not in the “Israel can do no wrong” crowd. Sadly, many of my fellow Americans are, and thousands of my tax dollars over the years have gone to support that naive and delusional policy – much of which is based in bad (and flat out wrong) protestant theology.
Yeah, AS, I feel you.
It is a bit disorienting though to see what is happening. You have three main forces in the US: The Dems, the Establishment Repubs and MAGA Repubs. The Dems support the war in the Ukraine. The Establishment Repubs do also. It is only MAGA Repubs which are opposing it.
On Israel, the Dems are divided. Some support the Palestinians, some Israel. Most all the Repubs are pro-Israel.
But the natural affinity of the conservatives should be Russia and the Palestinians due to the fact that they are forces of traditional nationalism, rather than LGBT-BS. But the neo-cons seem to have occupied the field. The liberals should be uniformly in line with the Ukraine and Israel because they are the core of the liberal world order. But the progressives can’t stomach Israel.
Clown show.
We live in an age of exaggeration, hypocrisy, ignorance and hyperbole.
And flat out lying.
Al-Jazeerah, far from neutral, did their own investigation. It may provide a timeline which other more dispassionate analysts can use to isolate from where the explosion originated. But the type and size of the explosion, as Berletic said, points to the IDF.
I can’t really blame anyone for being fooled by the propaganda, being as extensive as it is. But ask yourself who seems to be repeatedly trying to cover up what happened. In any event, no one plausibly asserts that Israel is not bombing indiscriminately.
Right. And even if this particular hospital bombing wasn’t Israel (it was), they are carrying out other illegal and retaliatory attacks on civilian targets and killing civilians. This is not defense, it’s just plain genocide.
They cry out as they strike you, indeed.
‘Truth is the first casualty of war’ comes to mind, in what feels like a wildfire of hatred in a hurricane of nefarious agendas. Lord have mercy.
This may be a minor point, but this has repeatedly been referred to as a “Baptist” hospital, but I’m seeing reports that it was “Anglican.” Which is it? I mean, if we can’t even get this straight, how can we be sure about all the other “facts” we’re trying to sift through?
Bingo!
Wikipedia says it was founded by Anglicans in 1854, run by Baptists for 20 years and since 1982 run by Anglicans again.
Yes, I have seen Gaza sources refer to it as “the Baptist hospital run by the Anglican Church.” It’s known by both names.
Let’s see if I remember my Country Joe and the Fish.
and it’s 1…2….3….
what are we fighting for?
don’t ask me I don’t give a d$&m
just send me to Jerusalem!
and it’s
5…..6….7….
open up the pearly gates
don’t ask to wonder why
Whoopee!
we’re all gonna die!
Not quite sure if I got the lyrics right.
What’s sad, is they could lock us up for this. We had MORE freedom back in the day when we thought we had lost it. Generation Z should look up from their phones and start paying attention.
****
Country Joe And The Fish
Well, come on all of you, big strong men,
Uncle Sam needs your help again.
He’s got himself in a terrible jam
Way down yonder in Jer-u-salem
So put down your books and pick up a gun,
We’re gonna have a whole lotta fun.
And it’s one, two, three,
What are we fighting for ?
Don’t ask me, I don’t give a damn,
Next stop is Jer-u-salm;
And it’s five, six, seven,
Open up the pearly gates,
Well there ain’t no time to wonder why,
Whoopee! we’re all gonna die.
Come on Wall Street, don’t be slow,
Why man, this is war au-go-go
There’s plenty good money to be made
By supplying the Army with the tools of its trade,
But just hope and pray that if they drop the bomb,
They drop it on (there own damn selves).
And it’s one, two, three,
What are we fighting for ?
Don’t ask me, I don’t give a damn,
Next stop is Jer-u-salem.
And it’s five, six, seven,
Open up the pearly gates,
Well there ain’t no time to wonder why
Whoopee! we’re all gonna die.
Well, come on generals, let’s move fast;
Your big chance has come at last.
Now you can go out and get those reds
‘Cause the only good commie is the one that’s dead
And you know that peace can only be won
When we’ve blown ’em all to kingdom come.
And it’s one, two, three,
What are we fighting for ?
Don’t ask me, I don’t give a damn,
Next stop is Jer-u-salem;
And it’s five, six, seven,
Open up the pearly gates,
Well there ain’t no time to wonder why
Whoopee! we’re all gonna die.
Come on mothers throughout the land,
Pack your boys off to Jer-u-salem.
Come on fathers, and don’t hesitate
To send your sons off before it’s too late.
And you can be the first ones in your block
To have your boy come home in a box.
And it’s one, two, three
What are we fighting for ?
Don’t ask me, I don’t give a damn,
Next stop is Jer-u-salem.
And it’s five, six, seven,
Open up the pearly gates,
Well there ain’t no time to wonder why,
Whoopee! we’re all gonna die.
The church of St. Porphyrius in Gaza has been bombed. Casualties not known yet, but some 500 were in the complex.
https://orderofsaintgeorge.org/confirmed-bombing-of-st-porphyrios/
Yes Lord have mercy I spoke with a Palestinian Orthodox Christian doctor from Bethlehem, a good friend – her colleague, also a doctor had 3 relatives killed in this Israeli airstrike. At the time they confirmed 7 dead, but could be many more under rubble. They cant reach casualties under the first floor because well into the night there and no electricity. The church is close to the AlAlhi Hospital.
Statement from Jerusalem Orthodox Patriarchate
https://en.jerusalem-patriarchate.info/blog/2023/10/20/the-patriarchate-of-jerusalem-condemns-israeli-airstrikes-targeting-humanitarian-institutions-in-gaza/
Mother, Google is saying this image is coming from Ukraine. https://sumy.depo.ua/rus/sumy/zaginulo-7-doroslikh-ta-2-ditey-u-dsns-pokazali-naslidki-aviaudaru-rosiyan-po-sumakh-202203081432429
Forgive me Gail but I don’t know what the picture you are linking too has to do with the statement from the Jerusalem Patriarchate condemning the Israeli airstrike that hit a church hall of the St Porphyrios Greek Orthodox Church causing extensive property damage and scores of wounded and dead parishioners who had been taking shelter at the church because of the Israeli bombings. As I said before I can confirm at least 7 dead hours ago; a generally reliable source Anglican cleric Fr Mitri Raheb recently posted on Facebook that there were 40 dead. There are many more photos and videos than the one you have dug up showing the property damage and the casualties if one chooses to look for them.
Maybe you aren’t aware that I was a member of St Mary Magdalene Convent (ROCOR-MP) in Jerusalem from 1996-2006 and during that time had the obedience of administering The Orthodox School of Bethany from 1998-2005. I left that community in 2006 but have taken pilgrims to the Holy Land every year since. I have visited the Church of St Porphyrios in Gaza. I left Jerusalem in 2006 but have returned nearly every year since with small groups of pilgrims I often personally drive around Israel and Palestine, the Holy Land. Based on that life experience and the numerous relationships built up there I can heartbrokenedly assure you the Church property in Gaza was bombed and scores of innocent civilians are dead and wounded. Also how could one think the Jerusalem Patriarchate would make up such a thing???
Pained in heart knowing the suffering all are enduring in the Holy Land now, Muslim, Jewish, and Christian; at least for one day let us put aside the skepticism and political agendas, and let us offer a prayer for the dead and wounded of St Porphyrios Orthodox parish in Gaza.
Sadly, ironically not 2 hours before we heard of the bombing I had called another Orthodox friend in Beit Jala who had friends at the church in Gaza. I was asking her to compile names and photos of some of the parishioners in order to draw attention to the plight of the Christians in Gaza. You see I attended a rally in Washington DC yesterday organized primarily by Jewish Voices for Peace to call upon the US Congress to push for an immediate ceasefire and a deescalation of the violence in Gaza. The hope is that a similar minded Christian Voice for Peace in the Holy Land could be organized. Letting people know the faces and names of Christians in Gaza was one thing I hoped we could do. Little did we know that so many of the names we will share now will be those of the dead. May their memory be eternal!
https://twitter.com/omarsuleiman504/status/1715136197566025841/mediaViewer?currentTweet=1715136197566025841¤tTweetUser=omarsuleiman504
Mother, no one is disputing anything you have said. No one is accusing anyone of making anything up. The loss is real and it’s horrible.
You say, “Pained in heart knowing the suffering all are enduring in the Holy Land now, Muslim, Jewish, and Christian; at least for one day let us put aside the skepticism and political agendas, and let us offer a prayer for the dead and wounded of St Porphyrios Orthodox parish in Gaza.”
I am praying. I have been praying for that part of the world for a very long time.
And I would like to request that you, too, put aside the skepticism and political agendas, and pray for the dead and wounded on both sides, which would include St Porphyrios Orthodox parish in Gaza, of course, but not to the exclusion of the pain and suffering of the people on the other side, as well.
Surely God would not want us to focus so much on our own suffering that we forget about the suffering of others.
There’s a line in the Shakespeare play of Romeo and Juliet where the prince says to two waring families who both lost their children: ALL ARE PUNISHED.
That’s the way I feel about Gaza and Israel.
I did post an earlier reply to you Gail. Perhaps a delay due to late hour to post
This link now shows footage after the bombing of St Porphyrios church hall. Notice at very beginning on the door the Tau Fe Greek lettering signifying Brotherhood of Holy Sepulchre (symbol of Jerusalem Patriarchate properties throughout Holy Land).
As videographer walks thru damaged tombs before reaching collapsed church hall (still bodies underneath) we most clearly aren’t in Ukraine
https://youtube.com/shorts/V-SmDiCAasg?si=Yj3TmohMbM-k_hTc
Yes, this appears to be a church. Not the hospital we were talking about earlier.
This was not the previous picture you posted that may have linked to Ukraine. I acknowledge that.
Real people are getting hurt and killed. It’s positively horrible. Especially, if it’s in an Orthodox Church because that’s our Church. Since it was at night, I hope no one was there.
Mother, what isn’t as clear is the who did it. This is a war. People on both sides of the equation do despicable things and blame it on each other to influence public opinion.
Let’s say I’m fighting for Hamas where there would be a 98+% probability I am a Muslim and I want to hurt Israel. I wouldn’t want to take out a mosque, because that’s where I worship, but if it’s an Orthodox Church, at night, where few people, if any, would get hurt, I might target an Orthodox Church with the weapons made in the West so it would look like Israel did it. Weapons Biden made available to Afghanistan, for example. (Which, IMO, was the REASON he left them behind.)
Perception is a big part of every war. He would be doing what I would expect any combatant to do.
It’s also possible Israel hit that Church on purpose. I am not disputing that. If I were an Israeli soldier, I would probably target a mosque before a church because it would have more of an impact on a predominantly Muslim community, but who knows?
The thing is, looking at the rubble tells us nothing about how it came to happen. Is it bad? Of course, it’s bad. Did Israel do it? Perhaps. Did Hamas do it? Also a possibility.
So a videographer walking through damaged tombs before reaching a collapsed church hall with bodies underneath (at night??? How would one know???? They haven’t gotten to any bodies because they’re under the rubble) doesn’t tell us much.
The “who did it and why” part of the story is the most difficult to answer. That it could be either side is a given.
The IDF has acknowledged in a statement to CNN that it was their airstrike, directed against “the command and control center belonging to a Hamas terrorist,” that damaged the church compound.
The church may not have been the target—but by Israel’s own admission, it was their fighter jets that destroyed an outbuilding of an Orthodox church and killed people there.
They acknowledged “a wall of a church in the area was damaged” as a result of the IDF strike. They didn’t acknowledge they destroyed an outbuilding of an Orthodox church and killed people there. – Got to be precise with the story.
But I never said anything about what happened to the church one way or the other. How could I know? I was just trying to demonstrate how little we know about anything’s over there and the extent both sides would go to to play on your emotions.
I did write about the hospital. Someone else brought in the story of the church and further confused the situation by using a picture of a church from Ukraine.
My contention is this (not directed at you): We don’t really know what’s happening over there. It’s not (or should not be) our fight. Lord knows we have enough of our own problems. I’m not going to host prayer lists for either side, as relatives may not know their kin have passed. Nor do I believe the suffering of a people anywhere for any reason trumps the suffering of other people just because one group is on “our side.” It’s like we’re rooting for teams in a football game.
***
Greek Orthodox church in Gaza hit in an airstrike, church officials say
From CNN’s Mohammed Tawfeeq, Kareem Khadder, Abeer Salman and Ibrahim Dahman
The St. Porphyrius Greek Orthodox Church was hit in an Israeli airstrike on Thursday nigh, according to its owners and Hamas.
The church’s campus in Gaza City is owned by the Orthodox Patriarchate of Jerusalem, which said in a statement they “remain committed to fulfilling its religious and moral duty in providing assistance, support, and refuge to those in need, amidst continuous Israeli demands to evacuate these institutions of civilians and the pressures exerted on the churches in this regard.”
“Targeting churches and their institutions, along with the shelters they provide to protect innocent citizens, especially children and women who have lost their homes due to Israeli airstrikes on residential areas over the past thirteen days, constitutes a war crime that cannot be ignored,” the Patriarchate’s statement read.
An Israeli airstrike caused one of the buildings belonging to the Greek Orthodox Church in central Gaza City to collapse, the Hamas-controlled Ministry of Interior and National Security said in a statement on Thursday, adding that many people who were taking shelter in the building were injured.
The Israel Defense Forces (IDF) on Friday acknowledged that “a wall of a church in the area was damaged” as a result of the IDF strike.
“Earlier today, IDF fighter jets struck the command and control center belonging to a Hamas terrorist involved in the launching of rockets and mortars toward Israel,” IDF told CNN in a statement.
“The command and control center was used to carry out attacks against Israel and contained terrorist infrastructure belonging to the Hamas terrorist organization,” the statement continued.
“We are aware of reports on casualties. The incident is under review,” the statement read.
“Hamas intentionally embeds its assets in civilian areas and uses the residents of the Gaza Strip as human shields,” the IDF said.
People like Brian Berletic and Larry Johnson:
https://sonar21.com/after-weighing-the-evidence-israel-appears-responsible-for-the-bombing-of-the-al-ahli-hospital/
understand that these are Israeli strikes. They know the types of munitions involved and what the blasts look like and sound like on video records. That’s the best you are going to get absent a forensic investigation.
I don’t have any doubts at this point at all.
What’s interesting is that the meme is emerging that the lefties who initially blamed Israel should apologize now that the Establishment has made a firm ruling that it was a stray rocket from Islamic Jihad.
Empire of Lies. That the US government says something is likely makes it much less likely in my estimation that it actually did.
Mother Agapia are you still in ROCOR?
Please send me names of those suffering and those who have fallen asleep in the Lord from that horrible tradgedy at the Orthodox Church in Gaza so I can commemorate them at proskemede.
fatherdeaconjohn@gmail.com
Lord have mercy!😭
Who was behind the Gaza hospital blast – a visual investigation.
https://www.brighteon.com/3919616d-f0c1-4560-acca-4d2dbede23e8
[Video – 05:18]
For once, an even-handed look
from a British TV channel
Israeli politician is blaming Russia for supporting Nazis against jews and says that Israel’s next target is going to be Russia! …echoing Biden’s recent speech…
See: https://odysee.com/@RT:fd/weitmann_1810:0
Here’s the latest analysis from Larry Johnson:
https://sonar21.com/more-evidence-and-more-confusion-surrounding-blast-outside-of-al-ahli-hospital-as-israels-pr-campaign-falters/
And it does look like St Porphyrios Greek Orthodox Cathedral has collapsed as a result of nearby bombing.
Israeli Airstrike on Church of Saint Porphyry:
It Survived Crusades & Wars for 1,000 Years (Video)
https://www-pronews-gr.translate.goog/amyna-asfaleia/enoples-sygkroyseis/israilino-aeroporiko-xtypima-stin-ekklisia-tou-agiou-porfyriou-eixe-epiviosei-apo-stayrofories-polemous-epi-1-000-eti-vinteo/?_x_tr_sl=auto&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en
Strong reaction from the Patriarchate of Jerusalem: “It is a war crime”
Dear Dcn John,
Bless! I have been with Rocor under Metropolitan Agathangel in communion with the GOC (see hotca.org) since 2007.
Sorry thought I has posted the names earlier.
Information came from a Palestinian Christian employee of the Jerusalem Patriarchate whose sister is a nun at St Mary Magdalene
Most were young, even babies -where is the voice of the Christians😢🙏
Editor Note: I apologize, but we can’t post the full names of the dead based on 3rd hand information. If a mistake were made or a family member hadn’t yet been informed, we could be doing some real harm during an already difficult time.
Are you HOTCA.ORG or ROCOR, Mother?
Gail, I found an official list of names from the Jerusalem Patriarchate and I will be commemorating them at the Proskemede. Thank you for this blog and your support.
Oh, good!
Please provide link to names so others can commemorate in proskomedia and liturgy.
Will appreciate this!
He provided his email address.
I am with ROCOR under Metropolitan Agafangel who was a bishop with ROCOR-MP until May 2007. His Synod remained in communion with the Synod in Resistance (“Fili”). Glory to God in 2015 there was a merger of the majority of the Old Calendar Greeks (GOC).
Hotca.org is an English language website listing the parishes of the GOC in North and South America. For practical administrative reasons the GOC in the Americas has a synod of bishops headed by Arcbishop Demetrios of St John of San Francisco Monastery in Cobleskill NY (https://www.saintjohnsmonastery.org/)
So I am under a ROCOR bishop (websites only in Russian) and in communion with the GOC.
Thank you!
A dose of reality…
Col Macgregor: Avoiding Armageddon:. “We simply
don’t have very many soldiers or Marines…..”
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8vacDom3adc
[Video – 04:02]
‘ Judge Napolitano: How can we the United States and the West avoid Armageddon?
Col. Douglas Macgregor: Well, that’s the that’s the question it should be on everyone’s mind in Washington and sadly it seldom comes up I think the greatest challenge for Americans. Even more than for the Israelis is to understand just how profoundly the world we live in has changed Since the last major war that the Israelis were compelled to fight and that was in 1973.
Some of your Observers and audience may remember in 1973 Israel was attacked by the Syrians In the east in the north and at the same time attacked from the south and the west by Egypt. The problem was that Egypt had very limited goals. The Egyptian president was not interested in destroying or eradicating Israel. He simply wanted to regain control of the territory that had been lost in 1967. So, he moved across the canal set up a defense and that was as far as he went The Syrians of course did try to break through and that was somewhat desperate for a period of time But the Israelis were able to meet that threat first Before turning their entire attention to Egypt.
This time the situation is very different!
First of all the weapons have changed. The arsenal of rockets and missiles in the region is enormous. People are quoting numbers in the realm of a hundred and thirty thousand rockets and missiles from Hezbollah alone. We don’t even need to mention others in the region that kind of arsenal is enough in and of itself to destroy much of Israel.
Then you have a problem with Hamas and Hezbollah and the rest of the region and that is the rest of the region is a sick of Israel as much of the world and Europe is sick of us and what I mean by that is that We are on the threshold of total war.
That’s what no one seems to understand if the Israelis march into Gaza, which I think would be a very unrewarding exercise for them, but nevertheless, they seem determined to do it, and if they do they will not only lose soldiers they will fail to root out the thousands of Hamas fighters that are there. They’ll get some but they won’t get them all. They will not improve their position at all with the people of Hamas or the people living on the so -called West Bank. And the rest of the region is prepared to go to war too. Stop and think about it. It’s not just Iran. In fact, Iran has militias that can attack us, anyone who works with this in Iraq and Syria. That’s one part of the problem. The Iranians are not going to try to lob theater ballistic missiles at Israel because the Israelis have said they would use a nuclear weapon, but Turkey is different. And the Turks have an unhappy record with the Israelis.
Just a few years ago, they tried to deliver humanitarian ai to Gaza. The Israelis boarded their ship, killed some of their citizens and turned back the aid. This kind of thing did not cultivate support and friendliness in Turkey. And remember, Mr. Erdogan is the de facto leading military power in the Sunni Muslim world.
Finally, you have the Pakistanis who are very close to the Turks and have made it abundantly clear that the Turks will receive nuclear warheads and other capabilities from them if they need them in order to deter the Israelis from using a nuclear weapon.
And finally, the Turks have the largest air forces and armies in the region. The Turks can put two million men in the field in the space of a little over a month. And the Turks are ferocious fighters.
Now, all of this spells doom for the Israelis if they launch this attack on Gaza. What I just described is an unwinnable fight. Even the air power from the United States that we could commit is not going to be enough. And we all know we don’t have the troops on the ground. We simply don’t have very many soldiers or Marines at this point. ‘
One man in DC with integrity (courtesy of Andrei Martyanov):
“We found one man of integrity, courage and principles in Washington.
“A senior official in the US Department of State responsible for weapons transfers has resigned in protest, stating that Washington’s rush to arm Israel was “shortsighted, destructive, unjust, and contradictory to the very values that we publicly espouse.” Josh Paul had served as the director of the Bureau of Political-Military Affairs (PM) for more than 11 years. On Wednesday, he published his resignation letter on his LinkedIn profile. HuffPo was the first major news outlet to report it on the same day. Paul said he took the job knowing that it entailed “moral complexity and moral compromises” and strived to make sure that “the harm I might do could be outweighed by the good I could do.”
“I believe that in our current course with regards to the continued – indeed, expanded and expedited – provision of lethal arms to Israel – I have reached the end of that bargain,” he explained his decision. Washington was repeating the same mistakes that it made for decades, he wrote. The policy is “an impulsive reaction built on confirmation bias, political convenience, intellectual bankruptcy, and bureaucratic inertia.”
“This is what it takes. Especially when identifying the core problem highlighted in yellow. It is not easy, believe me, and it takes cojones, big ones. You may also recall what it took for such people like Larry Johnson, Ray McGovern or Scott Ritter to defend their positions on critical national security issues–that too took a courage. So, here we are today and somebody finally said “enough”. I’ll be making a video later today.”
Here is a thread with Hananya Naftali’s original tweet. He is Bibi’s spokesman. Notice, he suggests that Israelis are striking civilian targets including hospitals, mosques and schools, including this particular hospital, which they claim Hamas is using as human shields. This is described as being run of mill for them.
Also notice that in the revised tweet, Naftali denies that that is Israeli policy.
RE: “. . . is that anyone believes what the AP or any other mainstream outlet reports or “investigates” for even a split second.”
I was addressing George, as he and I were talking about the AP last night. If nothing else, they put a cherry on the top of a story so it can be put to bed.
Looks like Al-Jazeerah pulled the story you posted on 10/19 at 10:15.
Click on it now: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RcNMPlj1iAA
https://www.the-express.com/news/world-news/115929/hamas-gaza-hospital-attack-forensics-israel-conflict
https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2023/10/22/canada-says-it-is-confident-israel-not-behind-deadly-blast-at-gaza-hospital.
https://www.cnn.com/videos/world/2023/10/18/gaza-rocket-hospital-blast-vpx.cnn
Like the guys at the fabulous Duran said today, the ‘neocons’ want war. And they’re going to get their war. Even if it means getting a bloody nose for it.
Now that you mention the Duran, which is linked from here,
can I just mention that Jackson Hinkle has been closed down
on YouTube, so the link from Monomakhos no longer works?
However The Dive With Jackson Hinkle is now on Rumble @
https://rumble.com/TheDiveWithJacksonHinkle
Any word on our friendly American journalist who was arrested (like everyone else) in Ukraine for reporting actual news? Coach Red Pill, I believe is his handle? Any word, yet?
This is all I have found…
Gonzalo Lira Court in Ukraine Update & News.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J3NFwA7KfrI
“Gonzalo Lira scheduled for Court in Kharkov again
on October 2nd and November 10th, 2023. ”
Then in the comments below:
‘ @alancantu2557
2 weeks ago
Any updates from Gonzalo’s October 2nd court appearance? Commenting this on October 10th. If the Ukrainian authorities throw him in prison, it will be a damn shame.
@UkraineWarUpdates
2 weeks ago
I just checked. Nothing yet. ‘
I changed it. Thanks.
that’s good to know. BTW, I have no info on Gonzalo.
I read that he’s still in jail. Maybe when the war collapses, someone will rescue him.
Tucker Carlson Tonight 10/23/23 E.P 33 | Col Douglas Macgregor
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZueKCE7h5oI
[Video – 39:48]
Col Macgregor offers a bleak analysis of current reality…
Straws in the wind?
Russian Su-37 fighters intercept two US B1-B
bombers and a UAV in the Black Sea
https://www-pronews-gr.translate.goog/amyna-asfaleia/diethnis-asfaleia/mayri-thalassa-i-rosia-anaxaitise-dyo-amerikanika-vomvardistika-v1-v/?_x_tr_sl=auto&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en
N. Bakhtseli: “If necessary we will enter Gaza before dawn –
Either a truce will come or Turkey will intervene militarily”!
https://www-pronews-gr.translate.goog/amyna-asfaleia/toyrkia/n-mpaxtseli-an-xreiastei-tha-mpoume-sti-gaza-prin-to-ksimeroma-i-tha-erthei-ekexeiria-i-tha-paremvei-i-tourkia/?_x_tr_sl=auto&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en
‘ R.T.Erdogan’s government partner, Devlet Bakhceli, made unprecedented threats against Israel, who spoke of Turkey’s sudden military intervention in Gaza if a truce is not reached!
At the same time, he warned that “either the truce will come or Turkey will intervene in every cruel and effective way”.
“If we have to go to Gaza, no one should worry.
With the help of God, with the admiration at the Al-Aqsa Mosque, we know very well how to go anywhere before dawn!
Let the children not die, let the babies and women not die. May the tyrants be destroyed, curse the slaughterers” he said characteristically.
“There is no hope from the Islamic Conference, no result came from the Peace Conference in Cairo for Gaza. The Islamic states helplessly watch the bombing of Gaza. So the protection of Gaza is the responsibility of the Turkish people.
Either a truce will be reached and all sides will sit at the table for the two-state solution, or Turkey will take into account all possibilities to protect Gaza in the toughest, most effective and superior way,” he concluded .
It is worth asking why the West continues to “caress” Turkey and indeed Israel itself before the Hamas invasion of Gaza, they were on the path of rapprochement with Ankara.
An Israel which, based on RT Erdogan’s announcement, would proceed with joint drilling with Turkey in the eastern Mediterranean.
Bakhceli may even sound… graphic to some, but he is Erdogan’s government partner. ‘
Garland Nixon was asking Ritter about a report from Sputnik International about 24 Ukrainian jets downed in a matter of a few days by some mysterious new Russian air defense system. The pilots reported nothing out of the ordinary right up until the missiles hit. No warning at all. No trace from any of our surveillance. Just boom. Theory is that it’s radio signature tracking rather than radar locking. But we don’t know.
This is a message.
It is a warning to Western powers regarding Russian capability to down jets, missiles, etc. “We have stuff we haven’t used that will give us air supremacy in any impending conflict.”
Here is an astonishing 44 min tirade in which
Scott Ritter lets loose on all he sees as at fault:
Israel, the Uniparty, Congress, Netantahu etc…
But his chief scorn is reserved for RFK Jnr.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i0BEwWJskic
This is powerful, straight-talking.
It deserves a wider audience.
He says if there ever is a time for a revolution, it’s now! What the hell does he think is going on now? Why is he yelling at the people who have tuned in to listen? And why is whining? These issues are being talked about all over the Internet.
He keeps saying, “You can’t tell me how I feel.” Who’s trying to tell him how to feel?
“Who’s trying to tell him how to feel?”
If you watch the opening segment of Redacted News
and see Senator Biden sneering publicly at Major Ritter,
I think you will understand where Scott is coming from.
https://rumble.com/v3ruymk-breaking-its-starting-israel-begins-gaza-ground-invasion-redacted-news.html [timestamp 17:22 – 23:20]
Biden is such an ass. Truly.
Amen to that.
Brendan,
If you step back and look at it in historical terms, it is breathtaking the degree of cynicism and chutzpah that is demonstrated by the government of the United States regarding both the Ukraine and Israel. Since WWII, the US has mercilessly used both Ukrainians and Jews in order to pursue its perceived interests, or at least the interests of its controlling oligarchs.
Taking in Ukrainian Nazis to help in the anti-Soviet Cold War effort and encouraging them to preserve their ideology is one example. Using Ukraine as an attack dog against the Russian Federation to the tune of hundreds of thousands of dead Ukrainian soldiers fed into a meatgrinder with no serious prospect of victory, just to “weaken Russia”, is another example. In the end, Ukrainians will turn on their abusive masters much like the Chechens did.
Vis a vis the Israeli Jews, the record is equally appalling if you understand that the United States men in black don’t care at all about “Never Again” or a “Jewish homeland”. What they care about is having a huge military base in the Middle East, an oil drenched region, which is staffed by idealistic Jews rather than American soldiers. That is the actual justification for the investment and it is quite cynical in that all the Israelis who have died for Zionism have actually, in a sense, simply died for American hegemony in the region.
I mean, if you want a safe, sovereign state for ethnic Ukrainians or for Jews, neither Ukraine in NATO nor Israel at perpetual war with its neighbors actually fits the bill. It is these two countries’ ties to American interests which are the focus of most of their problems. Were Ukrainians to remain neutral and were Jews in Israel content to allow representative government alongside Palestinian Arabs in a state not explicitly Jewish controlled, then their fortunes would be profoundly different.
But they are all expendable and are being sacrificed on the altar of Western Liberalism.
Precisely – and I think Ritter would agree with you.
However, now he is no longer in uniform,
he no longer restrains his emotions
and says exactly what he feels.
PS: I agree with you too.
BTW, Garland gave a magnificent speech before the UN Security Council last week. I’ll try and find it.
Prophetic talk by Met. Neophytos of Morphou from back in February…
Folks, here’s an excellent summation of the world situation from our dear friend Misha:
https://youtu.be/Ci-7mHKLBlA?si=WqgYTrE92LJes3nh
It’s good. Enjoy!
Iran has set this thing up masterfully. What they are creating is a situation where the use of nuclear weapons by Israel or the US is as unpleasant for them as possible and thus making the emerging conflict decidedly conventional.
They used Hamas to strike Israel in such a way that Israel has no choice but to go after Hamas, which has retreated into Gaza. If Israel does not pursue them, they will just keep striking until they draw Israel into their trap.
They arranged for Hezbollah to make warning strikes in the North and threaten to intervene if Israel does what it has to do, invade Gaza. Thus, they have created a situation where a regional conflict is practically inevitable. Now, everyone can see this clearly who cares to look. Israel and the US have balked at blaming Iran squarely because of the implications. But Iran is not going to back off. They would not have initiated if they had any intention of backing off.
Now, attacks against American bases in the area have been initiated. And the US has retaliated to some extent with strikes against Iranian backed units in Syria. The US has moved two carrier groups into the area and may be moving two more. This is a clear indication that the US intends to challenge Iran and Syria. It would be overkill for any other purpose.
Turkey, the other day, basically said it would intervene if Israel continued attacking Gazan civilians. Erdogan praised Hamas as fighters for Palestinian independence.
Iran must believe it has an ace in the hole to protect it from both Israeli and American nukes. It is no secret that Iran has enough enriched uranium to make 5-10 nuclear devices. Given what they have done, IMO, it is reasonable to believe that they already have this capacity and the ability to deliver it via hypersonic missiles, which we already know they have.
That is the elephant in the room that does not seem to be openly acknowledged in the media, even the alternative media.
It seems that the assumption is that unless a state advertises their nuclear capacity like, for example, North Korea did, they do not have it. In the case of Iran, this is unwarranted. The reason to advertise is deterrence. But, as we know with Israel, word of mouth is just as effective.
What Iran may be thinking is that they will push their plan forward as far as it can go and simply see if nuclear defense is necessary. If it is, then it will be a very unpleasant surprise to someone. If it is not, then having the nuclear capacity gives the regime, its military and diplomatic corps the confidence to move forward with its plan.
The other thing is that Iran is putting Israel and the West in an even more terrible position by not testing a nuclear device. Do they have it? Will it actually explode if they fire it? We don’t know. It’s another uncertainty which might, under certain circumstances, actually draw the US and Israel into a belief that Iran may not have such a capability and thus cause them to err on the side of escalation. Iran is very aggressive and is not afraid of a fight, by all indications.
The rest of the setup is quite clever. In order for Israel to decisively act, it must necessarily draw other actors into the conflict. If it tries to drive the Gazans into Egypt, it will initiate a war with Egypt. If it continues killing Gazans, both Hezbollah and Turkey may very will intervene. So they have several bites at the apple. And they only need one other Muslim power to intervene in order to set off a chain reaction where all of the above are attacking Israel (and any Americans in the region).
So you have a dynamic unfolding where you could have Muslims attacking from Egypt, Lebanon, the West Bank, Jordan, Syria, Iran and Turkey. Turkey has the largest army in the region and can put two million men in the field. If the conflict stays conventional, and Iran is trying to maintain that, then Israel loses. Mutually Assured Destruction may prevent Israel from launching if they believe that Iran has nuclear weapons or if they take Pakistan’s threat to supply nuclear weapons to Turkey in the event of a war with Israel seriously.
Misha, not so long ago Hamas was assisting the ‘moderate freedom fighters’
attempting to overthrow President Assad of Syria at the behest of the USA.
In other words, Hamas was fighting against an important ally of Iran.
In this fight, Hamas was on the same side as the USA, whose soldiers
illegally occupy bases inside Syria for the purpose of stealing Syria’s oil.
The direct paymaster of Hamas seems to be Qatar, which opposed Assad.
Hamas grew out of the Muslim Brotherhood, who are Sunnis – not Shias.
Most Qataris, including the ruling house, are Salafist Wahhabis – not Shias.
The Iranians, including the government, are mostly Shias – not Sunnis.
The Assads are Alawites running a secular state supported by the people,
in which all faiths were safe and secure in the practice of their religion
until the Clinton State Department sent in the crazed head-choppers
of Islamic State, Al Qaeda and assorted other insane nutters to destroy
the peace and stability of a nation which would not follow orders given
by the ‘Rules-Based International Order’ of thieves, bandits and liars.
As your account of the current situation
fails to acknowledge these basic facts,
I find it less than compelling.
Whatever Hamas did in Syria, Hezbollah has been on record as saying that it will invade Northern Israel if Israel invades Gaza. Moreover, not only is Qatar a funding source for Hamas, but it is the place the US sent the six billion dollars the Biden Regime sent to Iran. So clearly Iranian money moves through Qatar.
Also, the WSJ published a story shortly after the Hamas attack that said Iran agents and Hamas agents met shortly before the attack and Iran gave them the green light. The reason I mention that is that the WSJ is not the NYT or the WP and, not being a cutout for the CIA or State Dept., they may have inadvertently committed journalism.
Loyalties in that region of the world are ephemeral. Sunni Saudi and Shiite Iran are now engaged in a reprochment orchestrated by China. Muslims are waking up to the value of joining forces against a common enemy. Both countries are now also joining BRICS.
That is the background of the timing of this Hamas terroract and military op. Hamas may have decided to take money and training from Iran. Somebody taught them how to conduct their impressive, though brutal, operation. They did not have this capability a few years ago. That “somebody” would have been Hezbollah, who learned quite a bit from both Iran and from the Israelis whom they fought to a standstill as recently as 2014. I mean, if Hamas took funding and support from Israel itself, why not from Iran?
I’m just proposing a theory or hypothesis that fits the facts as I understand them. There are those whom I respect who disagree like, for example, the boys at the Duran. But I bring a hard right perspective, essentially medieval, to the table which they would find distasteful. They would like to believe the best about Iran and the worst about the US. IMO, my advantage is that I see everyone as equally ruthless, just varying in cunning.
Five wolves in a pit.
Your account takes no account of the Occupation,
which means it is deeply flawed and unbalanced.
I recommend a 2018 talk by a Haaretz journalist:
Gideon Levy: The Zionist Tango: Step Left, Step Right
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQS-_9K5-Dk
[Video – 52:29]
Mr Levy sums up Israeli ‘values’:
“…we are the Chosen People and we don’t need to prove it.” [18:25]
“…we the victims, not only the biggest victims,
but the only victims around” [18:35]
“She [Golda Meir] once said ‘We will never forgive
the Arabs for forcing us to kill their children’.” [19:10]
If the Israelis refuse to accept their common humanity,
they and their state are doomed to vanish – again!
Sadly, they might take down the rest of us as well.
Brendan,
I don’t think you understand what I’m saying. I’m not judging the Palestinians or Iran for their hostility toward Israel. I’m sticking with Russian neutrality because I do not see the Israel-Palestine conflict in terms of black hats and white hats. They’re all black hats to me. The only white hats are the Arab Orthodox caught in the middle.
I do not side with the Israeli Jews for any number of reasons, the ones you have given above among them. They have idolized hubris in their maintenance of the Chosen People narrative as it is applied in Zionism, dehumanizing Palestinian Arabs as a necessary corollary to their ideology. They are no longer the chosen, nor are they “Israel” in the religious sense. The Church is the New Israel. And that is not even taking into account that the very existence of the Jews as a discrete religious community is a living rejection of Christ as the GodMan.
But neither do I overtly side with the Palestinians as Muslims. Equities aside, we will have to lock horns with them eventually, either by warfare or evangelism or both. So I don’t get sentimental about their losses, though they have certainly been victimized. The cultural hostility of Muslims to Christians is such that they can be allies, since the enemy of my enemy is my ally, but never friends. They murder us as if it were free. Turks have murdered countless Greeks and Armenians. Chechens have killed and murdered many Russians. It goes on even in refugee camps among emigres from Syria. Cold blooded murder of Christians for wearing crosses. We cannot live with them in peace. They must be contained at a minimum. That much is certain. To accept them as they are – to side with them as Muslims – is by definition to accept dhimmitude (or worse).
Perhaps it is a fine line.
That being said, my analysis is going to naturally militate in favor of “The Rest”, i.e., the non-Western resistance that is emerging. Russia has allied with Iran, Saudi and the UAE in BRICS. And Iran and Russia have longstanding diplomatic ties going way back into the Tsarist period.
I’m actually impressed by the sophistication of the plan that Iran and Hamas have implemented. Perhaps it will succeed in the Israelis folding up the tent and closing the shop, so to speak. That would be fine with me. Israel is a huge US military base and I would be more comfortable with Russia playing sheriff in the region. What it certainly has done is lionized the Muslim world against Israel and the West. Just look at the demonstrations in Istanbul and elsewhere in the Muslim world, as well as in London and NYC.
Massive. 1.5 million in Istanbul alone.
So I echo most every word you have written above except your rejection of my “account” as “deeply flawed”. All I would say on my behalf is that the fact that I condemn the project of the Israeli Jews does not necessarily mean that I am ready to canonize Muslims in Palestine, or anywhere. I will tend to say things that militate in their favor because they represent a challenge to Western Liberalism, which is so horrible that allying with Muslims is certainly justified.
Strictly speaking, I have no dog in the fight between Tzahal and Hamas, as such. A pox on them both. However, there are wider forces involved and at work and the conflict serves to further the Eurasian project.
Thesis: “Iran has set this thing up masterfully. ”
Antithesis: https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1718192456838107162/photo/1
Oh, no doubt the US wants war with Iran. I don’t dispute that at all. I just don’t think other countries sit around on their hands waiting to get screwed, that’s all.
However, Tsahal may be getting smarter. They are just easing into Gaza. So far, this has not provoked Hezbollah to invade in the north. If they simply slowly funnel troops in gradually, somewhat like Russia has advanced slowly, they may not provoke the wider reaction which Iran intended to incite.
But the night is young.
“…which Iran intended to incite.”
Hamas has agency. They are not puppets.
The same is true of Hezbollah.
War is not in the interests of Iran,
though the Deep State says it is;
and how reliable are they?
Oh, I’m sure Hamas has agency. That much is certain.
But so does Iran.
War actually is in the interests of Iran if they possess nuclear weapons. This is not because they intend to use them, but because of their deterrent value. Iran is buddying up with Saudi; however, they don’t fully trust each other and are still competitors to a certain extent, as is Turkey in the realm of political power. Iran wants to count the coup of Israel. This is no secret. They have said the same for decades.
What is fascinating is that so many people are purposefully looking the other way regarding the Iran/Hamas connection. The neo-cons happen to be right about the fact of this. That does not make them right about what to do about it. It seems that many others simply want to hide their head in the sand in the interest of containing the conflict by claiming that they have no evidence that Iran was “directly involved in the planning of this specific event”. Sounds like “baseless” to me. Disinformation.
There is a synergy at work here, or synchronicity, if you will. The neo-cons want their war with Iran, no doubt. Iran wants to harm or destroy Israel, again no doubt. Hamas and Hezbollah share the same motivation as Iran but they are on the front lines. While it is true that Hamas is Sunni and Hezbollah and Iran are Shiite, one should not give this more significance than it is due. They all hate Israel and are willing to cooperate as closely as necessary to seek its demise.
What Iran wants, after years of relative isolation, is to be a major player in the Middle East. They see this as their ticket to recognition in the region by the other Islamic nations. I have never heard anyone convincingly contradict that Hamas is largely funded by Iran, probably mostly through Qatar. Iran’s involvement makes more sense if you assume they have a nuclear capability. But that is not the only reason.
Knowing that Iran supports Hamas, we also know that somehow Hamas acquired the military and technological skills to pull off their operation from someone. We also know that Hezbollah, almost immediately, offered to open a second front in Northern Israel. So there are arrows pointing to Iranian involvement despite their superficial denials, accompanied by endorsements of the Hamas attacks.
But the question then would be, “How did Iran get so bold?” Surely an attack of this magnitude is going to blow back on them if it is understood (and I believe it is, behind closed doors, that explains everyone’s actions and rhetoric) that they supported or masterminded it. And, obviously, it has. America has two carrier groups on deck and other assets being arrayed. That’s aimed at Iran and Syria, not just Hezbollah.
What might insulate Iran from regime change or a major invasion?
Misha, all this tortuous reasoning serves to obscure
that the chief agent of chaos in the Middle East is,
and has been for decades, the United States of America;
to which role it began to aspire when it joined the Brits
in the overthrow of Prime Minister Mossadegh of Iran.
Since then they have clattered through the region
from regime change to regime change,
leaving a trail of destruction in their wake.
How many countries has Iran invaded since WWII?
How many countries has the US invaded in that time?
How many countries has Iran regime changed since WWII?
How many countries has the US regime changed in that time?
No. Iran is not a threat to world peace.
But the United States of America is.
Brendan,
Believe whatever you want to. No one’s stopping you. I ascribe the motive of maximizing power to all states. US is just one. Has US been the hegemon? Certainly. So it has shed the most blood. I do not argue it has exercised its power wisely. But I do not think other states are normally altruistic. It is curious that you do. That would not be the historical pattern.
So this is not good.
I don’t like people who have pat answers to everything because everything is always changing. Regimes change. Alliances change. People change. Israel can’t know their trajectory and we don’t know ours. The one thing we can be certain of is relationships all over the world are going to be change.
I also don’t like that Johnson keeps mentioning how he went to Israel and talked to Bebe. This reminds me of the people who have met Assad. They all walk away thinking he’s the most wonderful guy and that they forged an important, meaningful relationship with him during their 10 minutes together (whatever it was). Wives get together. Do a little sight seeing, maybe. Promises to do it again soon. Firm handshake goodbye. They walk away feeling they are friends and committed for life. We don’t need friends. We want business partners who are equally committed to our common goals.
The reality is public figures often want something from you. They are good at making you feel important when you’re merely a pawn and you’re being played. His commitment to Israel is too strong. He talked in another interview that people who are blessed by the Israelis are bless by God!
Israel may be our alley outside NATO, but we’re doing the heavy lifting. Also, Israel is rife with globalists. Not so good ones, too. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Israeli_politicians
They forced vaccination on their entire population. Standing with someone, anyone, “no matter what,” promising them boots on the ground is crazy. We don’t want our boots on the ground in Israel. We want our boots on the ground at our borders cleaning up the mess we have here.
Supporting Ukraine 100% and giving them more money,money we have to borrow when we’re already in debt is ridiculous. Thinking Russia is “evil” is also a serious problem in my estimation, as is bad mouthing Russia. The guy’s not as conservative as he portends. He is a globalists who reaches into his bag of tricks to find something conservatives like to say.
Calling 3 members of the BRICS Alliance, “The New Axis of Evil” is also not a smart move. That he doesn’t know this bothers me. Iran has shown some restraint recently. (1) They’re friends with Saudis who are keeping them in check and (2) they want to get into BRICS in January which means they can’t go around starting WW.
This is the problem with us: We jump right in without testing the water.
***
Mike Johnson, the new GOP Speaker of the House, tells Sean Hannity:
– “We can’t allow Putin to prevail in Ukraine”
– US “boots on the ground” may be required to “stand with Israel”
– Supports Israel directly attacking Iran
– Russia, China, and Iran are “the new Axis of Evil”
https://twitter.com/mtracey/status/1717921509623091389?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw
What say all of you?
Mike Johnson is part of the evangelical death cult that believes the modern Jews have a natural born right to Palestine. He will stop at nothing to enact what he sees as Bibi as the new Joshua.
As to whom we should side with, I agree with Brendan that Iran is not a threat to world peace like Israel and America are.
I would agree with Gail that the US should have trading partners, not allies. Israel in particular is a singular obstacle to this. There’s no natural reason we shouldn’t trade with Iran and Russia. But Israel’s existence makes it impossible.
Yeah, that’s what I’m afraid of, too.
The Israeli people don’t like what’s going on in their country either. They’re a captured nation, too. https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2023/7/16/protests-swell-in-israel-as-netanyahu-advances-judicial-plan
The Israeli judiciary question is widely misunderstood. But you can get a taste of it from the article Gail linked above. Netanyahu is trying to enable conservatism/originalism on the Israeli high court. That is the focus of his efforts. It is liberal, secular Jews who hate it and there are still a great many of them.
As to the “intelligence failure”, I noted this from TGP. I had seen Netanyahu’s tweet and his apology for it the other day but I assume he was being sincere and can prove what he asserted. It was my opinion from early on that the Mossad and Shin Bet were trying to set him up as well as invite the attack they wanted to clear Gaza.
It wouldn’t surprise me at all. People have different reasons for their discontent but the one thing they seemingly have in common (all over the world) is they’re fed up with the status quo. It’s clear to everyone that the powers-that-be do not have our best interests at heart. Perhaps even secular Jews, if that’s who all these people are. (Someday someone is going to have to explain to me how the far right differs from the far left. The distinction is lost on me. They both want to control everything.)
They aren’t Orthodox Jews, if that’s what you mean. The whole nation is liberal but not to the point where they’re OK with extinction. They mandated *all* the vaccines across their entire population. I suspect there are more than a few conservatives out there who are not too happy about this, too.
His generals may very well have set him up. It’s honestly the only thing that makes sense but to what end? How is this mess going to further anyone’s agenda? If we all die, we’re taking them with us. They know this, right?
This is a great video yesterday from The Duran on the situation in the Middle East/Israel
I remember a candidate for election to Shop Steward,
who swore he would never walk on the same side
of the road as all those corrupted union leaders;
who, when he got elected, crossed the road.
Yep! There is greed, of course, but also the “Epstein” phenomena where they get you to do something from which you will never recover if the information is released. I think Trump was chosen because he was one of the few people who couldn’t be bought.
Some of these people may be good domestically but piss poor internationally. Even Trump isn’t that good internationally, though his instinct against war is a good start.
Johnson has no power to order any military action so I don’t take what he says about that with any more than a grain of salt. Not his decision to make. Obviously he’s wrong on Ukraine, but it doesn’t matter because there’s nothing he can do to keep Ukraine from losing except perhaps draw it out a bit longer. But he seems reluctant to fund Ukraine, at least in the way we have been so far.
Re: Iran, again, he’s an idiot. I get the feeling Israel is walking into one great big prefabricated trap. They can’t just do nothing, but slowly easing into Gaza after Hamas and ignoring everything else as much as possible may be their best bet. But I’m not giving them advice.
Attacking Iran is a bad idea. Let’s set potential nuke capability of Iran aside for a moment. Their missile capability is formidable, as is that of Hezbollah, their agents in Lebanon. Hezbollah could saturate northern Israel with an estimated 120,000 missiles. Iran may have hypersonic missiles but surely has a large number of more conventional ones that could reach Israel. Iron Dome can only shoot down a certain volume.
Israel cannot afford to rely on its nukes unless it is in immediate danger of being conquered or wiped out. Otherwise, the precedent and stigma of being the second country to use nuclear weapons in war would reflect on them severely. So any war with Iran will likely be conventional. My guess is that Iran will receive considerable assistance from the other BRICS countries, especially Russia.
And let us not forget the Turkish factor. Erdogan wants to be the new Ottoman Sultan. Opportunity is knocking loudly these days.
Langley and the State Department are making some very bad decisions and just need to take a deep breath and step back from this whole mess and try to wind it all down. They want to preserve their boogey men to justify their budgets and that of the MIC, but they’re in over their heads and they need to back away slowly before they pose a further danger to themselves and others.
I have this weird feeling that what we’re seeing is a mop up operation. I really do think they’re freeing the Israelis from some very bad people.
All the principals from the CDC dealing with COVID are globalist Jews. Yellen, Blinken, Garland, Nuland, and many others in high ranking positions in our own government are also globalist Jews.
Both Bebe and Mahmoud Abbas are part of the WEF.
The WEF, the WHO and Gavi are about to lose diplomatic immunity given to them by the Swiss government because the son of WEF co-founder is calling for Klaus Schwab’s arrest. https://www.westernstandard.news/international/son-of-wef-co-founder-calls-for-klaus-schwabs-arrest/49825
I’ve been reading that the dead (burnt) babies and other atrocities were mostly faked. There is now a news blackout to hide whatever is really going on which may be nothing on the ground. What we’re not seeing are all the faces of the victims which normally accompany these wars. They should be all over the Internet. Clearly there are some casualties. Not denying that. But this could be one big psyop.
Syria was called to China right before this happened. So I’m guessing Assad was given a heads-up and yet Israel was caught off guard. That doesn’t make sense unless they’re targeting Israel or at least some part of Israel. Syria and Turkey are connected to Putin so I suspect they’re in this together, which would include Iran who, like Turkey, wants to come into BRICS. BRICS is under the control of China, Russia and Trump (Trump helped put this alliance together).
The tunnels are being blown up so this is an attack on ISIS as well as Hamas. All the trouble makers have to go. It’s a mistake for people to confuse terrorist groups like Hamas with the Palestinians. The people these terrorist groups protect are not the ones in control. It’s the terrorist groups that are in control.
In short, the globalists aren’t doing too well. Soros’ son has shut down 40% of father’s organizations and the Rothschilds have been having estate sales. They’re running out of money and no one is giving them more. Their world is collapsing. The bad people are heading toward their bunkers.
Erdogan is an idiot, to put it mildly. I’m not even sure he’s very trusted in within the Middle East. I’m sure he wants to restore the Ottoman Empire but he’s a dolt.
Can’t think of better words than those penned by Pete Townsend:
Meet the new boss, same as the old boss. We won’t get fooled again.
Torah Judaism on X
https://twitter.com/TorahJudaism/status/1716885091098534030
[Video – 01:17]
Rabbi Yisroel Feldman: “All lands should be returned to the Palestinian people” As Jews, “We will be safer under the Palestinian government”
Jews can never establish a state on earth, the Torah forbids this.
But the zionists came and declared war on the Torah and G-d and established an irreligious zionist state in the holy land, contrary to the Torah.
We want all the lands seized by the Zionites to be returned to the Palestinian people. …”
Torah, not Talmud.
The road not taken…
It’s honest Jews like these that I imagine will be the ones that convert en masse upon the preaching of Enoch and Elijah according to the testimony of the Church (cf the commentary on Romans 11 by St John Chrysostom, St Cyril of Alexandria, Blessed Theodoret, and commentary on Matthew 17 by Blessed Theophylact and St John Chrysostom)
Is Canada now a Nazi State?
https://www.thepostil.com/is-canada-now-a-nazi-state/
‘ Canada today is a monstrous Woke machine, finely calibrated to yield the globalist new world order of green economics and eugenics (aka, gender equality, transgenderism, euthanasia). This machine was constructed by the wildly popular Canadian prime minister, Pierre Eliot Trudeau, the father of Justin.
Political systems do not really disappear; they may fall into disuse for a while, until someone finds a use for them, and they reappear in a fresh iteration. Globalism is a fresh iteration of Nazism, for the two have the same core; they vary only in detail, because they must fit into the time-period in which they exist. Thus, the mistake often made by commentators is a lazy one, whereby Hitler and his Germany become the blueprint for comparison, while the core is never noticed, which defines both. What did Hitlerism seek to achieve? A purified humanity (eugenics), inhabiting a purified earth (environmentalism), a process facilitated by the state.
And what is the core of globalism? Less and better humans (eugenics), on an earth purified from the pollution of human activity (environmentalism).
Both Hitlerism and globalism function on the perfection-imperfection relationship—the former must continually seek out and destroy the latter. This is labeled “progress;” a better definition is the “great replacement,” in which anything marked as “imperfect” is to be replaced by the “perfect.” The agency doing the marking and the replacing is the state.
Eugenics for globalism is the marking of imperfect humanity (European, aka, “white”), which must be severely husbanded so that it can only exist on the margins. The perfect humanity is non-white, which must be given to dominate the earth. The only difference between Nazism and globalism is in the marking: “Jew” is now “white.” The end result is the same—the annihilation of humanity. … ‘
Globalism is International Communism. Run by khazars.
Giving the poor an education level fit for
hewers of wood and drawers of water…
Oregon Schools Eliminate Proficiency Requirements
In Math & English For Students
https://www.zerohedge.com/political/oregon-schools-eliminate-proficiency-requirements-math-english-students
‘ Two years ago, we discussed how Oregon schools solved declining scores by eliminating their requirements that graduates actually attain levels of proficiency in basic subjects like math and English.
In 2021, the changes were portrayed as just a temporary measure due to the pandemic.
However, the state just extended it five more years. It declared that such proficiency tests are unfair to students of color.
So, rather than give these students the level of education needed to excel in the modern workplace, schools will now process them out with degrees and call it social progress. … ‘
How will they know that these are not their friends?
When their children can neither read nor count?
When they can all be cheated in their change?
It’s possible that the Muslim world will use oil as its weapon rather than arms, or perhaps in addition. It has done so in the past and winter is on the horizon. Russia is not in the business of supplying Europe as it once did.
Kyiv to cut off Russian gas transit to Europe at end of 2024
https://uk.sports.yahoo.com/news/kyiv-cut-off-russian-gas-204100663.html
‘ … Ukraine does not intend to extend the Russian gas transit contract after it expires at the end of 2024, Oleksiy Chernyshov, chairman of the state-owned oil and gas company Naftogaz, said in an interview with Radio Liberty published on Oct. 28. … ‘
I expect that by the end of 2024 Russia’s border
will extend to Moldova, so this won’t matter.
Serbia and Hungary should be ok.
Was going to say that as well. As for the Europeans, well, play stupid games win stupid prizes.
I suspect this winter is going to be very rough on Europeans and especially European governments. I would not at all be surprised to see more government as the Elensky curse spreads even further.
At this point most European countries have ousted their Center/Center Left/Leftists governments in favor of Right wing governments (Slovakia being a outlier). Even in Scandanavia the Right governments are leading the polls, the AFD in Germany is rapidly advancing.
I suspect in the next year well not only be seeing the downfall of Z, but also Macron and Sunak. TBH on Mitsotakis since he just got elected so that might be a little more difficult, but, Greece is finally getting it’s act together with conservative coalitions
With great sadness, I must report to you that several members of Justin Amash’s extended family were killed recently in Gaza:
https://www.helleniscope.com/2023/10/31/former-us-rep-justin-amashs-relatives-killed-in-israeli-bombing/
I also ask forgiveness of Mr Amash, with whom I’ve had political disagreements in the past, when he was a member of Congress. This is not the time to rehash the reasons for those disagreements. Instead I ask for prayers for him and his family.