This is heartbreaking. The fact that the situation in Ukraine (at least on the Orthodox side) could have been fixed two decades ago is little known.
Now we know that thanks to the interference of the then-United States ambassador, Patriarch Bartholomew was prevented from healing the schism.
Why? Why would the West want to bollix the healing process? And why did the Ecumenical Patriarch give in so quickly? We’ve always known that the Phanar has been in the pocket of the State Department (at least since the time of Athenagoras) but Bartholomew’s real-time acquiescence seems unseemly.
Lord have mercy.
Patriarch Bartholomew of Constantinople
Source: Pravoslavie
It was possible to overcome the Church schism in Ukraine twenty years ago, but pressure on Patriarch Bartholomew of Constantinople from the American ambassador impeded it.
Head of the Ukrainian Orthodox Church press service Vasily Anisimov in his interview with Radonezh Radio spoke about the meeting of Patriarch Alexei II, Patriarch Bartholomew and Patriarch Ilia II of Georgia in Odessa in 1997.
“Before the meeting Patriarch Bartholomew spoke briefly with journalists saying that in Ukraine there exists an apostate schism, which is a tragedy for those who have fallen into it, and for the whole nation. Thus, the Ecumenical Orthodox Church urges all schismatics to return to the saving enclosure of the Church of Christ, which in Ukraine is the Ukrainian Orthodox Church. The patriarchs were to sign the address, distribute it to journalists and give a press conference. We went to the patriarchal residence in the monastery to sign it,” he recalls.
Later, the patriarchs came out in silence, got in their cars and drove away.
“It turns out that the American ambassador in Ukraine called the patriarchal residence, demanding Patriarch Bartholomew to the phone, saying that the USA, which supports the Constantinople Patriarchate, support Filaret’s schismatic “Kiev Patriarchate” in Ukraine and demanded that no such address be signed. One phone call, and moreover in a cynical and humilitaing form for Patriarch Bartholomew, thwarted the overcoming of schisms,” Anisimov said.
I seriously doubt the veracity of this report. It’s the UOC(RP) press secretary maligning Pat. Bartholomew and trying to make it look like his support of the Kyiv Patriarchate is an American plot.
If it’s true, what does Pat. Bartholomew gain from this exchange?
If it’s false, what does Anisimov gain?
I would say there’s an obvious rhetorical gain for Anisimov and nothing for Bartholomew.
Bartholomew gets to keep his throne, that’s what he gains. He serves at the pleasure of the United States government and the Vatican, not his synod. That should be obvious at this point. “What does he have to gain?’, indeed. It’s not what he has to gain. It’s what he has to lose. The man is a slave of Western interests. Nothing more, nothing less.
Evidence?
I know nothing of the politics of the European church. But, what this describes is as repugnant as seeing a photo of Pope Francis standing between two women who just got married, but one of them had a sex change operation. So, the picture looked normal. He cheerfully was giving them his blessing(sic) in unholy matrimony. Authentic servants of Jesus Christ, who know their God will not follow these bealzebumbbling fools.
George, is Anisimov an official of the UOC-Moscow Patriarchate or the UOC of Mr Filaret Denisenko?
Bartholomew quite openly supported a Unia during the Crete council. Nothing is beneath him. I await photos of him blessing Satan himself.
I’m no fan of Patriarch Bartholomew, but he is still in communion with the rest of Orthodoxy, and assuming you are also part of a canonical jurisdiction, we should not say one of our hierarchs is blessing Satan. Bartholomew is no more a bishop than other bishops, but he is also no less of a bishop. There is a way to criticize without being vitriolic or hyperbolic.
A heresiarch is most certainly less of a bishop than other bishops. That a synod has not had the courage to depose him is of no matter. Heresy is heresy. He has embraced it openly. That is the whole point of Met. Hierotheos’ efforts, in so many words. He just won’t put too fine a point to it yet.
And yes, embracing the Anglican Branch Theory and Protestant Baptismal Theology is blessing Satan in a way, given the attitudes of these other groups toward abortion and homosexuality.
Mark, Agreed, apparently Misha also gives more honor and respect to his comrade Stalin, than a Patriarch of our faith! Seems a cheap loaf of bread, and holding back the Nazis, regardless of the human toll, is all a Russian needs to to earn respect. Misha’s opinion, not mine.
In my humble opinion, all our Orthodox Bishops, and Patriarchs should stand clear of all political leaders. Simply being exposed to this scandalous election, where all our suspicions of mass corruption by the Government/Media/Big Business/Military co-op is out for all to see, should this not be enough for our Orthodox leaders to stand clear of such filth, before they too become corrupt. Perhaps it’s too late. I don’t know.
I love that our Orthodox faith is in the forefront of Russia, as opposed to the Protestant faith in regards to America, but at what cost. What percentage of the Russian Patriarch’s soul did he have to sell out to become so close to Putin. Who does our Patriarch in Istanbul have to bow down to, to remain in Turkey. I don’t know the answer, but I do know there is no free lunch for any of them. I was not impressed when Archbishop Dimitrios would not include Jesus Christ, or end his pray with Father, Son, and Holy Spirit, at both party conventions. Should I be uncomfortable to include Jesus Christ or The Trinity when I say say a prayer around a dinner party, or large social event, which might include my non-Orthodox Christian friends? Either be true to yourself and faith or simply don’t show up at all. Sadly now, unlike our corrupt political leaders, our spiritual leaders who are suppose to be role models to look up to and emulate, are in jeopardy of losing that honor, and perhaps even their souls. Lord have mercy on us all!
I agree. There is always a cost
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EIPPa5bbAnA
Spot on. Good job Lee.
Go Trump!
This goes back to Saint John Chysostom, who, besides his virulent imperial anti-Jewness, named the Empress from the ambo during Divine Liturgy as “Jezebel!” Awful!
Wow! First it was denouncing the Church’s canonical scriptures and now bad mouthing Saint John Chrysostom. Fritz is on a roll…down hill!
Peter’s posts are all about ME these days! Here he’s repeating a lie; namely, that I denounced ANYTHING!
I fear what caused this obsessiveness on his part was a question he could not answer. No doubt he confuses questioning with denouncing. How puerile! This is what knocked him off balance: “PETER! Answer this: in the book of Judges (KJV) CHAPTER 12, VERSE 6, we read, “Then they said unto him, Say now Shibboleth: and he said Sibboleth: for he could not frame it to pronounce it right, Then they took him and slew him at the passages of the Jordan…” How does your Septuagint surpass the KJV in rendering the Hebrew word Shibboleth?”
Still waiting, as his good bishop….
Not off balance at all. I just don’t feel like exposing your errors anymore. In fact, you are doing quite well at that youself without any help from me.
Peter
Petr Papoutsis!
PETER! Answer this: in the book of Judges (KJV) CHAPTER 12, VERSE 6, we read, “Then they said unto him, Say now Shibboleth: and he said Sibboleth: for he could not frame it to pronounce it right, Then they took him and slew him at the passages of the Jordan…” How does your Septuagint surpass the KJV in rendering the Hebrew word Shibboleth?”
Still waiting, as your “good bishop….”
Keep waiting.
“Keep waiting?” I’ll take that as “UNCLE!”
Peter,
Fritz is a classic example of a liberal: a person who refuses to take his own side in any argument. In other words, he is not really a bishop, or an American, or a man, or a human being. He is a liberal, animated by that ideology, and he will destroy any other expression, be it Orthodoxy or whatever, from the inside. That is the nature of liberalism. It is a sort of virus.
“No doubt he confuses questioning with denouncing. How puerile!”
That is what the whole “questioning” thing is about. It is a kind of Manichaean cult of Shiva. They are truly sick and thoroughly diabolical. Pay them no mind, or toy with them as you will. Alas, they are lost. While they cling to their sick ideology, there is no remote hope of salvation for them.
I just KNEW Misha was fascinated by Manicheeism and Hindu theology! His message makes me feel relieved to be a liberal! FDR, Adlai Stevenson, John Kennedy, Carter, Obama—-Olympians! All made America admired all over the planet, too! Trump inspires fear and nausea in equal measure. Clinton, flawed though she be, will not bring America down to the Trump/Coulter/Pat Robinson sewer level.
How the UN just eats away at the emotions of the Anti-Globalists!
Your Grace,
I don’t wish to be critical of you, but your comments are truly ridiculous. “FDR, Adlai Stevenson, John Kennedy, Carter, Obama- Olympians!” That’s some pretty powerful stuff you’re smoking there. I think you’re overdoing the medical marijuana.
Please read me with an open mind that you may achieve enlightenment. My friend, I will tell you who was a truly great President…. Calvin Coolidge. President Calvin Coolidge is the only president in US history to have a budget surplus every year of his presidency. He cut taxes and cut spending to achieve this wondrous feat, not to mention the fact that the country had a booming economy with no inflation. Imagine that, my friend, he actually paid down quite a bit of the national debt. Silent Cal- a great man. It must disappoint you, my benighted, dimwitted, addled friend, that our greatest President was a Republican.
chicken and egg story Peter, chicken and egg
Clinton had a booming economy as well
Guess who Coolidge taxes Peter?
The top 2%.
Not a Republican concept today
where is reality checker when we need her?
I might as well add this very recent arrest of Deacon Daniel McKay of the Serbian Orthodox Church of St John Maximovitch in Eugene,Oregon to my list of repugnant cleric’s. He was arrested for accepting the invitation of an underage female prostitute who was posing as one. This due to an alligation of a genuine underage female prostitute. There is also a charge of illegal drug transactions. This was engineered by the local Eugene police. Either, the police are utterly corrupt or Deacon McKay is one real bad apple. I was in Eugene when they ordained him. I had a person bout with him, over wither I was allowed to speak,( or preach) against the homosexual agenda. He tried to order me to stop speaking against this plague of the great whore. He is married with one child. This was before he was ordained. I got right in his face with the facts, and informed him he had no jurisdiction over.me.He had no jurisdiction over me after he was ordained. He struck me as a cold blooded totalitarian grace less power hungry hot shot. Proto – Presbyter David Lubliner sought his elevation. I dearly hope. if the charges are truthful, that they slam the cleric’s door in his face and defrock him. If he is falsely accused, may the Christ grant him the grace to bear it with the nobility of his office. Nevertheless, I know my beef with him is truthful. And he would best get in line with authentic Christian doctrine. What I don’t want to see is him being found guilty as charges, that the church moddycoddles him, with a poo poo pat on the wrist.
Drug use and pushing, fornication, adultery, and pedophilia are most unseemly when done while leading in prayer the faithful, who pray to the Holy God, while having a total ravenous wolf, good time when their not looking. Sneak!
“Canonical?” Patriarch Bartholomew? After Crete? Surely you jest.
Look, I have disagreements with the EP but unless and until he is formally and canonically rebuked by the Church he is still a canonical Patriarch. Period. Untill then he has my prayers and my respect. I can disagree with him, but still respect and pray for him.
Peter
The present situation with Pat. Bartholomew, as I understand it is the following:
When a hierarch becomes a heresiarch by proclaiming heresy as Church doctrine (which Bartholomew did leading up to the Crete council and through that council), he is already a heretic. However, unless and until he is condemned by a synod of the Church, grace does not leave the mysteries in which he participates.
HOWEVER, if one knowingly receives communion from a hierarch one knows to be in heresy, one does so unworthily and can be harmed by the reception.
Thus Bartholomew has put his own sheep in a pickle. As to the rest of the Church, they need to get on with calling him on the carpet or quit claiming to hold the Orthodox Faith.
Bartholomew was ready to drag by coercion as many of his brother bishops as he could into a Unia with Rome. Moreover, he was hell bent on having that same pseudo-council lock in a condemnation of all fundamentalists who opposed his efforts. If the traditionalist Orthodox do not believe he is coming for them, they are insane. This is not a matter anymore of who’s right, but of who’s left.
Our furry friends on Athos, in Greece and in Rus’ better wake up and take decisive action soon.
I’ve eased up on this a bit. Met. Hierotheos evidently believes he can reel Pat. Bartholomew back into the fold. I’m skeptical but have the utmost respect for Hierotheos.