Trifkovic. Russian Jet Down: Erdogan’s Reckless Gamble

Turkey Shoots Down Russian JetI woke up to this news this morning. The preliminary take was that Turkey was well within its rights as the Russian jet had violated its airspace.

The news since then has become less clear. Lt Gen McInerney (ret, USAF), a hawk, stated just an hour ago on Gretchen Carlson’s show on FOX, that Turkey clearly overreacted as the jet couldn’t have been more than 20-40 seconds over Turkish airspace. More, he said that Turkey was pursuing its own agenda, hoping to force NATO’s hand against Russia.

I’ve now heard that Erodogan’s son runs the truck line that ISIS is using to smuggle oil into Turkey and Israel and he took a big financial hit with Russia’s recent escalation against ISIS.

For more information, please read Mr Trifkovic’s interview below.

P.S. I’m really glad to see our President taking the position that a nation’s borders should be respected. As usual, he really gets his Irish up when it comes to defending Moslem interests.

Source: Chronicles | November 24, 2015

By Dr. Srdja Trifkovic

In his latest RT interview Dr. Trifkovic considers the ramifications of Turkey shooting down a Russian war plane over northern Syria on November 24. ?

RT: For more reaction let’s go to Srdja Trifkovic, foreign affairs editor at Chronicles Magazine. Turkey says it’s taking a tougher stand against Islamic State, and yet it downs a jet of a country waging a war on terrorism in the region. What are your thoughts?

ST: It is perfectly consistent with Turkey’s behaviour since it ostensibly joined the anti-ISIS campaign last July. Over 80 percent of the tonnage of their bombs were dropped on the Kurds fighting ISIS in northern Syria and northwestern Iraq. Turkey has been consistent in pursuing its own agenda, which is to pretend to be fighting ISIS while settling scores with one of the two parties which are actually capable of fighting ISIS on the ground—the other being the Syrian army. This is a reckless move by [Turkey’s President Recep Tayyip] Erdogan to throw spanners into the works of Russia’s increasingly high profile as the only serious player from the outside who is trying to do something, and which is reflected in the consultations between France and Russia. Erdogan has been increasingly prepared to take serious gambles in recent years. He is now trying to up the ante and to force the rest of NATO into a gesture of solidarity with Turkey.

Of course if you have the F-16s ready in the air even before the Russian jet allegedly violated the air space, it was evidently a setup. It was a deliberate trap which Erdogan ordered down the chain of command because he wants to test Russia’s response, and also because he wants to use—more accurately, to abuse—Turkey’s membership of NATO to force the rest of the alliance to adopt an overtly anti-Russian posture, while at the same time sabotaging the war against ISIS, with which he secretly sympathizes. So there’s a number of motives for him to act this way. In my opinion, when you put it all together, it is quite clear why he did it.

RT: In your opinion, how is the downing of this Russian plane going to affect the atmosphere in the anti-ISIL coalition?

ST: First of all, it will poison the relations between Turkey and Russia. Foreign Minister Lavrov is supposed to go to Ankara tomorrow, and I don’t know at this moment whether that visit will be postponed or called off. This is a provocation of such magnitude that it would call for the postponement at least, if not outright cancellation. [NB: Russia’s FM Lavrov did in fact cancel his visit to Turkey two hours after this interview was broadcast]

The atmposphere within the so-called anti-ISIS coalition has never been particularly harmonious, because too many parties have their special interests. First of all you have close American allies Saudi Arabia, the [United Arab] Emirates and Qatar, who have been financing, bankrolling ISIS. They will not move a little finger to harm ISIS, because they see it as a geopolitically important wedge inside the Shiite crescent that goes from Iran and Iraq in the east, across the Allawite-ruled Syria to Hezbollah in northern Lebanon. So they have their own secret little agenda, which is to hit the [Shiite] Houthis in Yemen and not to be serious about any anti-ISIS fight. In the long term Russia is the only serious outside player who is determined to hit them hard. In addition to the Syrian Arab Army, it is really just Hezbollah and the Kurds who are capable of providing some boots on the ground.

RT: Is this really the “nightmare scenario” that everybody has been warning about from the beginning? Was this an accident . . . or was it specifically planned, an act of war in fact by a NATO country attacking a Russian plane and shooting it out of the sky?

ST: I already outlined my views a few minutes ago: I think it is a premeditated, reckless act by Erdogan—not necessarily in consultation with other NATO countries, because there could have been some voices of caution trying to calm him down. It is obvious that the F-16s were already in the air and ready to fire their missiles, regardless of whether the Sukhoi 24 violated the Turkish air space or not. I think that his agenda is clear. One: to poison the relations between Russia and the West, Turkey’s NATO allies, and in particular with France; two: to assert Turkey’s role as the protector of the Turkmen rebels in the north [of Syria], because apparently the Russian plane was in action against the Turkmen rebels against the government of Bashar al-Assad; and three: to provoke Russia’s over-reaction, which would then make the whole set of circumstances surrounding the downing of the plane secondary to the need for NATO to respond forcefully. I think that Erdogan has a multiple game to play, with Byzantine duplicity and mendacity for which he is famous both domestically and abroad.



    The RF has put out its own flight plan to counter Turkey’s version.

    Here us the radar video released by the RF:

    Also, Turkey’s story regarding the timing of the incident is being called into question:

    “1. Each and every strike groups’ operation is to be carried out under the guise of fighter jets
    2. Air defense to be boosted with the deployment of Moskva guided missile cruiser off Latakia coast with an aim to destroy any target that may pose danger
    3. Military contacts with Turkey to be suspended”

    If I were a Turkish pilot or ground soldier, I would not want to be deployed anywhere near the Syrian border.

    If the Russian video is accurate and the plane did not enter Turkish air space, I would be very surprised if the Russians did not inflict some damage on the Turks in the very near future. There is speculation that this is in retaliation for all the rebel tankers destroyed by Russia in the last few days.

    Also this:

    It is possible that the Russian plane’s satellite navigation and the Turkish ground radar indicated different things to their respective operators. However, the article goes on to state that the circumstances on the Turkish side were very fishy in any case. It was like they were laying in wait with planes, cameras and rebels in place.

    * * *

    “But the Su-24 was in Turkish airspace for only seconds before it was shot down today, and diplomats at the NATO meeting told Reuters that they were concerned that the Turkish air force did not simply escort the aircraft out of its territory. There are some concerns that the Turks were simply waiting for the opportunity to shoot down a Russian jet—concerns magnified by the fact that a Turkish news crew was on site to capture the Russian jet being shot down.

    As part of the safety procedures established by a Memorandum of Understanding between the US and Russia, both sides are supposed to communicate on a specific set of frequencies in the air and have a communication line open on the ground. The Turks were likely aware that the Russians were going to be operating close to the border, where they have been targeting groups supported by Turkey and the US—including the Sunni Turkmen militia that apparently killed at least one of the Russian pilots. Video, posted by militia members to Twitter, of the fighter going down was accompanied by cheers of “God is great!” as the plane crashed.”

    • Bishop Tikhon (Fitzgerald) says

      I believe iy has now been publicly established (and confirmed by American military experts) that the Russian plane was shot down while in officially Turkish air space. I hope denizens of this blog are not so naive as to believe that such taunting is a HABIT of Russian jet jockeys–a sign of manliness and daring-do. THIS time the Turks were having none of it and tagged the criminals. Russia said they were SURE their jet-jocks’ conduct was pristine—just as they were SURE that the Malaysian plane was not shot down by Russian forces, and they were SURE their own plane was NOT bombed over Sinai. Why do so many associated with Monomakhos JUMP to attack America and act as defense lawyers for Russia? I think it’s local desperation politics of those who lost the last two presidential elections.
      It’s touching in a way…it’s SO AMERICAN to blame all political disappointment on the IMMORALITY of those with whom one disagrees. As usual, American culture is absolutely dominant in our world, so even the characters of Russian government have picked it up. When, I wonder, will Putin % Co. come up with “America the Great Satan?” They’re sure to get cheered on, not just by hierarchs and Muslim fanatics, but by many of the anonymous legion on Monomakhos!

      • The RF has released a radar track that shows the plane was in Syrian territory.

        As I mentioned elsewhere in this thread, it may be a case of dueling navigational systems. But even if the Russian aircraft did violate Turkish airspace for 17 seconds, the right thing to do would be to escort it back into Syrian airspace.

        Not to worry, though, The Russians won’t allow the Turks to do the same thing again. Future strike missions near the border will have fighter escorts and they have deployed a missile boat to the area as well. Moreover, they are sending anti-aircraft missiles to their airbase near Latakia.

      • Gregory Manning says

        Before I put in my tour of duty in Vietnam and for several years after that I too was a staunch “My country, right or wrong.” citizen. No more; because as a citizen I am no longer in charge of my country; these people, and more like them, are. And they aren’t by any stretch of the imagination, Christian-friendly. So, I am no longer merely an American now. I am an Orthodox Christian first and an American second.
        At the risk of making excessively broad generalizations, I see the northern hemisphere roughly divided between the anti-Christian West and the pro-Christian East. My vote is easterly. I sincerely wish it did not have to be so.

        • Patrick Henry Reardon says

          Gregory Manning says, “I see the northern hemisphere roughly divided between the anti-Christian West and the pro-Christian East.”

          Yes, I think this is right.

      • The whole incident was a set-up by Treacherous Turkey, Mr. Moslem Bishop Tikhon. You should be defrocked,
        if indeed you were EVER frocked.

        • Bishop Tikhon (Fitzgerald) says

          Gee! What got YOUR goat, J Clivas? I’m not a Muslim at all. I’m a veteran of the US Army (Signal Corps) and US Air Force, a retired captain in the latter, and I was ordained to the Orthodox Diaconate in 1971 and served as a Priest since 1978 and as bishop since 1987. I retired in 2007 and turned 83 on the 14th of this month.
          I don’t know that Turkey is any more “treacherous” than, oh, Byzantium or France, for example. Some people think Russia acted treacherously in reneging on their former recognition of Crimea as part of sovereign Ukraine. I’ve ordained a few clergy and consecrated a few churches, but I’ve never been “frocked” or “defrocked.” (The correct canonical term among the Orthodox is not “defrock”, but depose.
          I hope one day you’ll find peace in our Orthodox Church. Are you perhaps a Russophile from one of the Baltic countries? If so, a move to Holy Orthodoxy should not be difficult.

          • Bishop Tikhon (Fitzgerald) says

            I forgot to add that Putin and Erdogan are “birds of a feather,” and, in a way, they deserve each other. Many so-called American “Conservatives” may wish WE had birds like that!

          • Johann Sebastian says

            Little Russia has a Napoleon complex. This is how we end up with such absurdities as a “sovereign Ukraine” and a make-believe “Filaret, Patriarch of Kyiv and all Rus’-Ukraine.”

            Who the hell came up with that “Rus’-Ukraine” business anyhow?

            Ukrainian nationalists are nothing more than Russians who want to be Polish. Something’s got to be wrong with you if you want to be identified with a nation that doesn’t know what a lightbulb is for.

            • Bishop Tikhon (Fitzgerald) says

              Well, YOU know, Johann Sebastian! In the classical world, there was a Greece and a Great (or Greater) Greece, That “Greater Greece was mostly Siciiy and Southern Italy So, too, the original Kievan principality (and Metropolia) was called “Rus'”, while one of the outlying regions, around Moscow, came to be called Great or Greater Rus. [Later, the Muscovite rulers abandoned the Scandinavian “Rus'” almost entirely in favor of “Rossiya,”]
              “Ukraine” came into use to refer to southerly borderlands of (not Rossiya) POLAND. The Poles, though, called the peoples of Ukraine Rusyns, while the Austrians called them Ruthenians.

              Nowadays, Ukrainians sometimes like to point out that they are, in fact, the original “Rus'” This disturbs patriotic “Great Russians” of the Russian Federation and ABROAD, They react as many of us would react if a Navajo or Apache or Cherokee told us we’re not American at all!

              Oh, and neither Russians nor Ukrainians, as a rule “want to be Polish!”

              Ukraine is recognized as a sovereign nation by the whole world, including the government of the Russian Federation, even if the latter has a president that looks Mongol.

              • +Tikhon:

                Ukraine is recognized as a sovereign nation by the whole world, including the government of the Russian Federation, even if the latter has a president that looks Mongol.

                Napoleon III:

                Grattez le Russe, vous trouverez un Tartare.

          • Dear Vladyka,

            Sorry to had to hear that from JClivas. Some people have no sense of the value of their elders and betters. I was remembering how you said that you would like to have permission on a regular basis to go and sing with the choir of Joy of All Who Sorrow.and in general attend their services while you are in retirement. I concur. They have a beautiful choir. I am listening, late, to their liturgy today. They are both livestreaming and their archive their services, even the odd moleben or baptism. I am on their mailing list, so I get advance notice of theior services and can just click on them. You might want to go to their Livestream site and join the list, too, for those days in which you are stuck in and want to hear a nice service or to brighten an hour with a service already held.

            May God continue to save and protect you.

        • Dear Mr. Clivas,

          I have seen bishop’s comments upset many people on this blog…….inflaming the passions of his fellow Orthodox Christian brothers and sisters. Oftentimes, if you don’t agree with him, he will belittle you with subtle accusations. But you must respond with silence.

          He is elderly.

          • Gail Sheppard says

            Bishop Tikhon can run circles around just about all of us, Mikail02. Clearly, you have not been schooled.

            You might want to talk with your spiritual father about your own passions and why you would disparage a bishop. We don’t do that in the Church. We can disagree, but not disrespect.

            • Dear Gail,

              It is true that his grace is a very intelligent man. It was not my intention to disparage him.

              I constantly speak with my spiritual father/confessor about my passions….and they are many. Thank you for reminding me to speak with him again……and thank you for reminding me that I am not schooled. I truly have much to learn.

              If I have offended anyone on this blog, I deeply apologize. And if I have offended you, bishop Tikhon, please forgive me.

          • Nicholas Chiazza says

            His Grace may be elderly, but he is still sharp. If he disagrees with some of the posters on this blog, that is his opinion and his right. Calling him “elderly” with the suggestion that he is senile is not only disrespectful, but an outright lie. I believe there is a commandment against harming the good name of a person? Pray, and don’t talk so much.

            • Hi Nick,

              I did not say he is senile. I said he is elderly. That is not a lie. I did not harm his name. My comment was in jest…..insinuating that we get crabby as when we get older. I know I do.

              I pray that God permits me to live to the ripe old age of 83 and beyond! I need that much time and more to repent of my infinite sins.

              And yes…he often disagrees with posters on this blog…..and it that is his prerogative. I happen to think that he is mistaken most of the time….and that is my prerogative.

              Furthermore, you are correct….I should pray and not talk so much. That goes for all of us.

          • Bishop Tikhon (Fitzgerald) says

            Mikail02! You hit the nail on the head in your accusations! I take it YOU are one of those “fellow Orthodox Christian brothers and sisters” whose passions I “inflamed.” What I don’t understand is your saying that OTHERS “must respond with silence”—-YOU didn’t!

            PS I’m disappointed, though, I’ve never considered any of my “accusations” (?) to be subtle at all, but plain and open rebukes. If an elderly hierarch isn’t allowed to administer rebukes, especially against false witness, who says so?

            I ask everyone to control his or her passions.
            I think I’ve avoided anything that could be interpreted as “subtlety” in this message?

        • Patrick Henry Reardon says

          J. Clivas says, “Bishop Tikhon. You should be defrocked,”

          Come off it, buddy. Such disrespect is most uncalled-for.

      • You state: “Why do so many associated with Monomakhos JUMP to attack America”?

        It’s actually not “America.” The rogue faction that currently does have political clout in America is not America. Just from hearing what you say I have to surmise you are a two time voter of Obama, the guy who when he gave speeches at two Catholic Universities, Georgetown and some other one boarded up the insignia for Jesus Christ. Of course those “Catholic” universities themselves are ‘Judases’ likewise if not the greater. Now let me guess, you support the ‘wiccan witch’ Hillary and her sex molester husband as your “American” candidate of choice and logical extension of Obama? She is his carbon copy mirror image.

        “As usual, American culture is absolutely dominant in our world”

        First, there has to be “culture.” Black Friday at Walmart? Culture? BLM protests all over everywhere, Fergusson Baltimore, and now on and on, Chicago, culture? Bushes wars in Iraq, “Shock and Awe,” “Arab Spring,” and now generating ISIS, all of that ‘culture?’ Everything on television spewing into living rooms never ending raunchy sex humor of prime time sit coms, culture? The Universities and all the never ending Political Correctness agenda and now also the Gay LGBTQUIAA and any other letters, all that, “dominant” culture? America certainly had much great culture in past decades centuries however it has been going down hill in recent years especially since the illiterate George W. and Obama with his never ending White House dinners with rappers and sports celebrities etc. and golf outings he should be on the pro circuit all that golf practice. Other point, no one is coming up with “America the great satan.” NATO other hand is becoming to resemble the dragon in the Book of Revelations with its bombing of Kosovo Orthodox churches and monasteries and Serbian people; now you have ISIS, you have Turkey, next, who knows what.

        • George Michalopulos says

          Cy, agreed. To say that the sewage that spills out of Hollywood, or the Maoist “education” that comes out of our universities bears any resemblance at all to “culture” is ridiculous.

          • Bishop Tikhon (Fitzgerald) says

            George! What is particularly or generally MAOIST about ANYTHING taught in or coming out of our universities? Please just try to answer THAT question without diversion,

        • Nicholas Chiazza says

          Some farm is missing its turkey.

        • Bishop Tikhon (Fitzgerald) says

          “Cy!” You apparently have an inadequate understanding of what culture is! You apparently only recognize “higher” elements of a society as “culture.” All societies, even primitive illiterate societies have CULTURE. Get it? The dominant culture in the world today is American. You have people eating MacDonalds “fast food” everywhere. Mac Donalds is part of American culture. So is rock music, So are levis, short skirts. Popular American music, musical performers, and media are dominant in Moscow, Qatar, Tokyo, Berlin,
          Islamic cultures are spending time, effort and WIND trying to hold back the onslaught of American CULTURE! You hypothesize that I am a fan of the Clintons. WHAT A COCKAMAMIE idea! They’re BOTH crypto-Republicans—no more Democrats than were Wendell Wilkie, DD Eisenhower, Double-you Bush, Richard Nixon, or Mitt Romney! They never met a banker, industrialist or movie star they didn’t adore.
          Please get it straight and don’t misrepresent me or my words. The American CULTURE is the dominant culture in the world today, and the culture of NO other country or society in the whole world comes even close! Did I say the American culture is BETTER or MORE ADMIRABLE than all other cultures? No. I said it is THE most dominant, powerful culture in today’s world.

          • Fr. Harry Linsinbigler says

            Your Grace, I believe that they are confusing “culture” with “civilization.” You are right that they all are cultures. Are they all civilizations? Not by the first two definitions of the dictionary (the third is “all inclusive,” so yes, in our watered-down, all-inclusive way of speaking, we have even managed to make a way for the term “civilization” to be politically correct).

            • Bishop Tikhon (Fitzgerald) says

              Fr Harry, Just wanted to point out to Putin Groupies here, that Putin and Russian culture are no match for America in any culture war. American culture today does what Hitler wanted his Germany to do: it rules the world.
              Further, It’s true that America has problems, but, for example, the rate of H.I.V. infection in the US has been on the decline for many years while Russia’s rate continues to climb and climb, notwithstanding their alleged (not by me) religious superiority!

              • Michael Warren says

                McCulture, McColonialism, even McOrthodoxy for the orthodoxist renovationists here…

                I will take that bet, your Grace, on who wins the culture war. The celluloid exploiters and McEmpire with its godless, gay crusade. Or Orthodox Russia acting to liberate and free the world from neo colonialism.

                You don’t seem to understand that your point of view has divided the world in class and moral struggle, do you? America is now hated even more in the world than it was during the Vietnam era.

                It is an amoral, degenerate civilization in decline. It has become the evil empire of yore.

                And you prefer that to Orthodox Russia as an Orthodox Bishop?

                • Terry Myles says

                  Orthodox Russia has more Muslims that the decadent US. Did you see “Imam” Putin at the dedication of the largest mosque in Russia, not far from the Kremlin. Holy, Orthodox Russia?

                  • Michael Warren says

                    Islam has had a presence in Russia for over a millenium, but is a minority religion limited to ethnic groups which support Orthodox Russian civilization.

                    President Putin is president of a 70% Orthodox Christian majority as well as a less than 10% Islamic minority. So for for him to be present at the dedication of a mosque is appropriate.

                    I would suspect you voted for Mitt Romney who is a bishop in a religion which is less Christian than Islam. Moslems don’t worship Lucifer as a god, don’t believe in Luciferian godhood and don’t believe Lucifer is the brother of JESUS.

                    PUTIN prays and communes in Orthodox churches, goes on Orthodox pilgrimages, and is committed to defending and spreading Russian Orthodox civilization.

                    But that’s the inconvenient truth which doesn’t suit the hate filled narrative of red, white and blue uber alles.

                    Russophobia is simply blatant in its baseness.

                    Your emperor Obama on the other hand was educated in Moslem madrassas and funds, trains, arms, defends Islamists he terms “freedom fighters” who perpetrate massacres against Christians in the Middle East and on American soil. Yeah, electric Uncle Sam pays for Islamists to behead 18 month old infidels and broadcast it on Al Jazeera. Obama even buys Islamist “freedom fighters” brand new Toyotas to get around so that they can propagate Islam by pogrom for US neo-colonialism. Your Kenyan emperor is demanding the West absorb a large and often radicalized Islamic refugee population.

                    While Putin with Orthodox Russia is incinerating Islamists in airstrikes and ending their reign of terror.

                    So if anyone is committed to revising history and undoing the victory at the Battle of Tours… Or a not so closeted Islamist.

                  • It’s funny, people criticize Russia for repression of Protestant sects, etc. and now we have someone criticizing them for building a mosque in Moscow.

                    The Russian Empire (“Holy Russia”), the Soviet Union and now the Russian Federation have always had considerable numbers of those of other faiths within. Putin sees that he can project a good Islam and a bad Islam, the bad Islam being “extremist”. “Extremist” means anyone attacking Russia or Russian interests or using the tactics of terrorism. Good Islam being those who are willing to respect the RF – period.

                    Thus, he is splitting the Middle East between Muslims he can do business with and Muslims who should always be look in the rear view mirror.

              • Michael Warren says

                Do tell us, your Grace, how many hospitals you are prepared to destroy with drone strikes and how many democratic protestors you are prepared to herd into trade union buildings to burn to death to defeat Orthodox Russia with your “superior civilization” which seems to have the world on the verge of revolution with its cadence of red, white and blue uber alles in the tone of brown.

                The world sees your superman, and it is the banal image of Ronald McDonald wearing a swastika with Rosie O’Donnell doing the voice over. No, Orthodox Russia, which defeated the papal crusaders, the Mongols, Napoleon and Hitler, is not in the slightest worried, but she is preparing…

                • Bishop Tikhon (Fitzgerald) says

                  mICHAEL, Calm down! I did not utter even one word about “superior civilization,” but about cultures/ The Russian Federation is not an Orthodox country, but a multi-religious country.

                  By the way, while the rate of H.I.V. infection has been declining everywhere else, ONLY in Putin’s Russia is it still on a steep increase!

                  • Michael Warren says

                    Russia has a 70% Orthodox population and Orthodox civilization, culture, worship and identity is celebrated tbroughout the government and nation. Russia is an Orthodox country which tolerates traditional, religious minorities. That’s the inconvenient truth for a West which is committed to a gay crusade and post Christianity. The restoration of the churches and support of the Church is funded by the government. Not since tsarist times has Orthodoxy been so prominent in Russia, perhaps even moreso now that the synodal system is abolished and The Church has been emancipated. The Russian Federation is an unapologetic Orthodox superpower.

                    And AIDS was the product of the Soviet system or San Francisco bath houses and McCivilization, your Grace?

                • Terry Myles says

                  Moscow “defeated” the Mongols by paying tribute and prostrating for a few centuries – very heroic.

                  • Michael Warren says

                    At least russophobes could be accurate and read history before indulging their hate.

                    St. Sergius of Radonezh. St. Dmitri Donskoy. The Battle of Kullikovo Pole.

                    Yes, alliance with the Mongols was and is preferable to a degenerate West. That’s why Russia is today an Orthodox superpower.

                    People who discount the great podvig of Russia often do so in hatred and envy of her Orthodoxy, her civilization and her march through history of great achievements. Almost always in dark ignorance.

                    But that is to be expected when Western culture’s chief folk icon is Ronald McDonald.

                  • Michael Warren says

                    There will be an Orthodox Russia 1000 years from now, but there probably won’t be a United States of America…

                  • George Michalopulos says

                    Well, they did get rid of them eventually, didn’t they?

                    Really, there was no way that Alexander Nevsky could have fought a two-front war and be successful. He made a strategic calculation: the Germans and Swedes would have forced the conversion of Rus to Catholicism, whereas the Mongols were remarkable tolerant in mattes of religion.

                    It was a hard choice but the only rational one available to him.

                  • Bishop Tikhon (Fitzgerald) says

                    Yes, Terry, even St Alexander Nevsky still annually submitted his rule to Mongol approval, but today’s Putin-Russians never mention itthat

                    • Michael Warren says

                      Actually, prior to all of this American colonialist expansion, V V Putin was accused of being a Neo-Eurasianist. Alliance with the East recognizing the course laid by St. ALEXANDER Nevsky is a founding principle of that movement. Mssr. Dugin celebrates it. And he is probably right at least on tbat score.

                      But the essential point is that Russia did not pay tribute to the pope, to crusaders, to Europe, and as such emerged as a triumphant Rus’ from Tartar tribute to defeat and conquer the Tartars and liberate and reunite the Russian and Ruthenian lands which did pay tribute to the West and accept papal crowns. A Russia which remained faithful to Holy Orthodoxy was blessed by GOD to become an Orthodox superpower. That is a great podvig of our Orthodox civilization. Those Ruthenians who did pay tribute to the West we liberated after centuries of foreign oppression and religious persecution.

                  • Michael Warren says

                    America “defeated” Al Qaeda by arming, training, funding, defending and buying them a fleet of new Toyotas after renaming them “Syrian freedom fighters.”

      • Would these be the same “military experts” that were responsible for the Tonkin Gulf Incident, Granada ,Kuwaiti incubators and Iraqi WMDs?

  2. I wonder if this is the beginning of WWIII.

    St. Paisios’ prophecies come to mind…

  3. Gregory Manning says

    Tony Cartalucci is right. Russia will not take the bait. Putin’s gotta have nerves of steel. But it’s edge-of-your-seat nerve wracking nonetheless.

    • You may be right, Gregory. Putin seems to be using this incident to put more assets in place and pound the Turkmen, et al. along the Turkish border. Strike aircraft in the future will have fighter escorts. What Russia knows now is that Turkey is also an enemy and now it will be treated with suspicion and contempt – its soldiers and its allies within the area of conflict are now high priority targets.

    • Terry Myles says

      The Cartalucci article you reference is from the “New Eastern Outlook”, a publication of The Institute of Oriental Studies of the Russian Academy of Sciences. An objective source of information, no doubt.

      • George Michalopulos says

        Instead, we should look only to The American Enterprise Institute, the Wilson Center and Commentary for objectivity, right?

      • Gregory Manning says

        You miss the point Terry. Mr. Cartalucci’s analysis of the situation of the downed Russian fighter jet was a collection of premises which led to his conclusion. His conclusion, based on his analysis of the situation, turned out to be correct. In this case, his article witnesses to the “objectivity” of New Eastern Outlook, not the other way around. To deny the accuracy of the analysis and prediction because you feel that the journal which published it is un-objective is, well, subjective isn’t it? Really, it doesn’t matter whether the article appeared in New Eastern Outlook or Auto Trader. I’m not a fan of The Huffington Post but I’ve read some really great stuff there. The best way to inform one’s opinions is to read the pro’s and con’s. The only exception is the subject of Christianity, a topic on which most media are distressingly uninformed. In my experience, such reading leads to serious grinding of the teeth and evil, wicked fantasies about The Department of Education having been unknowingly built on top of an ancient volcano which instantaneously comes to life.

  4. Bishop Tikhon (Fitzgerald) says

    GOSH!!!!!!!! George took Putin’s side! Gish!!!!! perhaps Turkey feels Putin should end his “hands-off” policy toward ISIL, INSTEAD OF TAKING OUT SYRIAN OPPOSITION YO ASSAD?
    Has that retired (armchair) general asked for a briefing from anyone on active duty, such as the Joint Chiefs of Staff?

    • Turkey simply “feels” like the Russians should stop attacking their rebel brethren in Syria and quit interfering with the sale of ISIS oil.

      And here was Russia’s response:

    • Nobel Prize Winner brings world to DEFCON 1 says

      The Nobel prize winning, crackhead, Traitor-In-Chief, known as Bathhouse Barry has created the world’s largest humanitarian crisis. Looks like the Russian “reset” was meant to reset the Doomsday clock back to DEFCON 1.

    • Vladyko,
      The second pilot has been recovered safe by the Syrian Army and he says that they were well within Syrian air space when attacked, something which the Russian MoD confirms. Last year, Turkey violated Greek air space over 2,000 times without losing any planes. What is the goal here? Erdogan’s son, by the way , is a major intermediary in the sale of stolen petroleum and has lost a bundle from Russia’s air campaign.

  5. Russia is not the enemy. Turkey is the enemy. So let’s take a look at this:

    Turkey shoots down a Russian fighter that was (maybe) in its airspace for 17 seconds….with an American F-16. One of the pilots was shot to death in his parachute by rebels who are armed and supported by America. A Russian helicopter was destroyed by an American made TOW missile used by the terrorists that are armed and supported by America. There are no “moderate rebels” in Syria. They are all terrorists. The U.S. knew about ISIS and hoped that they would take down Assad. And now we continue to give arms to this mythical “Free Syrian Army.” We should be fighting with Russia. When Mubarek was taken out, we were told there was an “Arab Spring.”…….instead we got the Muslim Brotherhood terrorists……who were supported by the B.O. administration. In Libya, Gaddafi was taken out. The country descended into chaotic terrorism and our ambassador and other Americans were killed at the embassy. No “Arab Spring” there! Saddam Hussein was taken out in Iraq…..and…well… know how that story goes. I know many Christians from Syria. They respected Assad. Muslims and Christians lived peacefully with each other. And now our president supports Turkey! I am hoping that someone will wake me up from this nightmare soon.

    Lord have mercy!

    • Daniel E Fall says

      John McCain and Lyndsey Graham were the tow biggest proponents of arming Syrian rebels. They were chastizing Obama for about a year for not doing so.

      Assad’s gotta go..

      If the Rusky was smart; he’d put Assad n co on a plane and put a temporary government in place.

      The real problem is power vaccums like democracy fail. A new dictator would be preferred.

      • Gregory Manning says

        Right or wrong, Russia has always been loyal to her allies. Don’t actually know what Putin thinks of Assad but, pending more verification, a lot of Syrians love the guy. Local Christians do too. If Assad steps down it will be at a time when it’s beneficial to the country and Russia, and Putin will have a big say in this. Given the success with which Putin talked Assad into giving up his chemical arsenal to help get the West off his back (didn’t work) I suspect Putin will work something out that allows Assad to step down while saving face.
        Keep in mind Putin is adamantly against any one-world/one-government scenario. He made it clear at the U.N. that Russia had tried that and it was a dismal failure. He really believes that each nation is entitled to it’s own autonomy and that this is the only way to go. If the people want a tyrant for a leader, so be it. If that tyranny becomes grizzly and/or that tyrant tries to “share” his nastiness with neighbors, stronger nations are obliged to step in. Otherwise, leave them alone. It’s up to the people to decide. Understandably, this is very hard for us in the West to deal with.

      • John McCain and Lindsey Graham — two clowns who never met a war they didn’t like. Don’t make me laugh.

        • George Michalopulos says

          They’ve been called “the Batman and Robin of the permanent war caucus” by others.

        • Texan Orthodox says

          As the saying goes, “John McCain never met a troubled country that he didn’t want to bomb.”

          Seriously, though, much as I admire his service and heroism as a POW in Vietnam, Sen. McCain needs to retire and spend his days playing golf in Scottsdale. Why he doesn’t, I have no idea. He’d do our country a lot less damage that way and might have some peace. And Sen. Graham is a joke. He sounds like an angry teenage girl most of the time.

          Happy thanksgiving everyone. Or as the Orthodox say, ευχαριστώ! Thanksgiving is the most Orthodox of all the “American” holidays.

        • Daniel E Fall says

          One of those clowns was the right’s nominee.

          My point is for the anti-rebel crowd.

          • McCain was most emphatically not the “right’s nominee.” He was nominated because of a quirk in the GOP nominating process that inexplicably gives disproportionate weight to primaries held in states like NY and MA that the GOP will never win in a national election. And of course the conservative vote was split that year while the moderate vote wasn’t. As so often happens in GOP primaries…

            • George Michalopulos says

              Edward, thank you for pointing that out. Ever since 1988 (Bush the Elder), the GOP Establishment has jiggered the entire nominating process to favor the Establishment’s candidate. Lately (esp 2008 and 2012) they were very ham-handed about it. If this year proves anything at all it’s how FOX news has become an adjunct of the GOP Establishment. So far, it’s all blowing up in their faces.

              Not that Dole, Romney, et al were bad men in and of themselves (they weren’t) it’s just that they never had the hearts and minds of the faithful. Only Reagan could lay claim to that but in retrospect, we can see that he was a fluke and they’ve made sure that a true conservative would never be nominated again.

              • cynthia curran says

                Hey, George I would take Romney anytime and I think you worshipped Reagan too much. I lived in California and when he was governor he was to the left of Romney on taxes and abortion but Conservatives like yourself don’t remember that Reagan did more liberal things than Geoge W. Incrased the payroll taxes even if he lowered the marginal rates As for Trump the last insult against disabled reporter shows the guy is pretty mean spirited and nasty. In fact even Tom Tancredo supports Cruz over Trump

                • George Michalopulos says

                  Cynthia, Romney was (is) a good man. I’d vote for him again in a heartbeat. My point was that Romney, McCain, Dole, the Bushes, etc. were not “movement” conservatives or conservative enough to push the Overton Window to the right to the extent that Reagan did.

                  What Reagan did was spectacular on so many fronts, not the least of which was that even Clinton adopted many of his economic policies and kept the American economy going great guns.

      • Daniel E Fall says

        48 dislikes-is that a record?

        Someone-Peter maybe told me the truth is tough.

        So let me repeat.

        The American right wants Assad gone.
        So does the left.
        Sorry to carry the mirror.

      • The problem with “put Assad on a plane” is that the Syrian people genuinely prefer him to the alternative. I know that this does not matter to the State Department, but even the Qataris have acknowledged that he has an 83 % approval rating with Syrians and almost equivalent rating with Arabs in general.

    • observations says

      Cuckhold Obama will have to watch as Putin pushes deeper into the Middle East. Turkey has provided Putin the moral authority to place state-of-the-art weapons systems in the region, and exert complete control over the entire area. I hope Putin re-takes Constantinople from those degenerate toilet squatters!

      The “religion of peace” strikes again. Hello, Multiculturalism is the logical extreme of Ecumenism. The final solution is to expel all the Moslems, and illegal aliens, and Homosexuals, and Lesbyterians, and Zionists, and Feminists, and Liberals, and all the other 3rd World Invaders.

      Russia allegedly violated air space for 17 seconds, and Obama supports Turkey’s right to defend itself. But 11 MILLION Mexicans illegals violate our AMERICAN air space 24/7 and he likes it. Merkel has 3 MILLION rape-u-gees violating European air space and she issues free ball gags to all the white women!

      • There are currently more Mexicans leaving the US than entering.

        • Johann Sebastian says

          They’re not leaving fast enough.

        • Patrick Henry Reardon says

          There are currently more Mexicans leaving the US than entering.

          Is this true?

          • George Michalopulos says

            I seriously doubt it. It’s just MSM propaganda to try and take the wind out of the Right’s sails on this issue.

          • cynthia curran says

            Its a pew Hispanic Report with studies from the Mexican government. Its saying that many Mexicans still prefer the US but get homesick and the advantage of the US is dropping somewhat compared to 2007. I think its somewhat true but the thing that might bring up immigration from Mexico again is the peso is down. US imports are more expensive when the peso is worst against the dollar it has to do with the price of oil. Mexico’s currency value is weight along with the price of oil since they are an oil producer.

            • Several years ago , I priced a set of bed sheets at a Walmart in Cuernavaca at 1200 pesos. When I got back to San Antonio, I happened to go into a Walmart and found exactly the same sheets priced at 56 dollars, the equivalent of 650, pesos back then. The topper was that the sheets were fabricated in Mexico. Walmart was marking them up almost 95% in Mexico. Thank the Free Trade Agreement. Mexico has become a net importer of corn buying mostly from genetically modified Cargill. Essentially, Mexican agriculture is in ruins because Mexico does not subsidize its ag the way the US does. And who says socialism (for the rich) does not work.

  6. Stabbed in the back says

    Putin chose his words carefully when he said “stabbed in the back.” The Germans used the same expression after the first world war, and they were referring to the jewish communist workers unions. Putin knows Israel is to blame for everything. Israel buys the cheap ISIS oil, bombs Iran and Syria, controls the US government, promotes Hollywood filth, pornography, homosexuality, usury, multiculturalism, and funds the #blacklivesmatter terrorists. “The Chosen People” have been chosen by Mammon to worship money and power in their Synagogue of Satan. Beware Goyim, they are devouring your children.

  7. “First of all you have close American allies Saudi Arabia, the [United Arab] Emirates and Qatar, who have been financing, bankrolling ISIS.”

    They have bankrolled al-Nusra and other Sunni jihadist factions (and different countries finance different rebel groups), but not ISIS. The UAE has been bombing ISIS. This doesn’t mean that individual citizens of those nations haven’t given money to ISIS, but citizens’ actions and policy are not the same.

  8. Providence tells me that many events will happen: The Russians will take Turkey and Turkey will disappear from the world map because a third of the Turks will become Christians, another third will die in the war and another third will leave for Mesopotamia.

    St Paisios the Athonite

    • George Michalopulos says

      For what it’s worth, at least 1/4th of Turkey’s population is Kurdish. I’ve never understood why the Kurds couldn’t have their own nation.

      • GM:

        I’ve never understood why the Kurds couldn’t have their own nation.

        Creating new nations for aggrieved minorities on the basis of self-determination would create more problems than it would solve. How would the Basques feel if the Kurds got their own country? The Catalans? Minority populations in sub-Saharan Africa, who have lived for decades in corrupt, non-functional “nation-states” created by the European imperial powers 100+ years ago?


    Pat’s two cents are well worth reading.

  10. Misha: Could there be a Turk-Saudi-Israeli coalition? I understood the Israelis were on the outs with the Turks.

  11. Pro-Kurdish Turks aren’t safe

    Turkey must look forward to peace also, amidst financial-militaristic opportunism, terrorism and because of that, the Kurds will be and have been the contested center. France and Russia joining forces against Turkey does not make them our enemy, in the States. If the U.S. is reluctant and refuses to join with France, England and Russia against IS in Syria, that doesn’t prohibit us from militarism in Iraq.
    The PseudoLeft loves to call this WWIII. Why this is not WIII: terrorism is not merely a struggle between sides, against Nazism/fascism, no single national enemy, etc. not merely about nation states in a geopolitical sense, since the announcement of the military industrial complex and international financial imperialism.
    In some way, it might be worse Fin de Siecle histories need to rest yet will eclipse our lives.

  12. Yesterday, Syed Farook and Tashfeen Malik were gunned down by racist white police in San Bernardino, California. The peace-loving members of the community were driving their SUV and enjoying sunny weather when they were suddenly surrounded by jack-booted militarized white Christian fanatical police. The oil-industry backed police department was concerned that Farook’s SUV was a hybrid model, and that it’s gas mileage was too good. Without any provocation, the racist officers gunned down the peace practitioners in cold blood.

    Farook was absent from a holiday party at work because the white racist Nazis, who just recently had thrown him a baby shower, had hurt his feelings. However, before the peaceful Farrook left the party he made sure to leave behind several gifts for everyone including remote-controlled toy cars with special Islamic holiday fireworks attached to them.

    Recently, Farook and one of his 77 virgins traveled to Saudi Arabia to learn health and safety techniques, which included beard growing for men. This government funded trip also allowed him to study various health inspector safety techniques for women such as wearing a hijab and burka.

    Farook’s family and members of the Religion of Peace are shocked. They never would have guessed that people who worship a child-rapist from the 7th century, and who taught that killing white people makes God happy, could ever have been victimized like this.

    • UPDATE:
      Further investigation has revealed that Farook’s Mexican, Indian, and African neighbors (aka White people) are members of the NRA, and they recently borrowed the Hybrid SUV to travel to a gun show and purchase AK-47’s. In response to this alarming news America’s President, who was raised by goat herders in Pakistan, called for the disarming of all White people. As an additional safety measure, he called for 10 million more Moslems and 50 million more Mexicans to be immediately brought here to protect America’s values.

      An interview with the Israeli-born producer and director of the theatrical production “The Sandy Hook Massacre” commented on the hidden meaning of the December 2nd date. He said that 12 times 2 equals the number of 6 year olds that Mohammed raped.

      Protestors from #blacklivesmatter cried racism after the MSM began flooding the airwaves with pictures of White men in order to assist investigators in tracking down the perpetrators.