Metropolitan Paisios of Tyana is seen on the bishop's throne, while his longtime associate Bishop Vikentios of Apameia is seen next to him.
Take special note of the last paragraph. Kalmoukos writes about the abused man:
He added that he became an atheist “because of the things that I have seen with Paisios and other clergy from everywhere, from Athens too. I know too much.”
Nice work guys.
You can read more in our section Bishops Behaving Badly. As you read the article consider these questions:
- When where allegations about Paisios first reported to higher-ups? Why was no action taken then?
- Why did Pat. Bartholomew remove Paisios and Vikentios from the United States in the middle of an investigation by state authorities?
- Who is the Greek Orthodox priest who is still employed by the GOA that brought boys to Paisios for sexual acts?
- What other places were the boys brought to? Were state lines crossed? (If so, this is a federal offense.)
- Are other bishops serving that have records for criminal sexual activity? If so, who? Why have they not been defrocked?
- Why do the GOA Bishops persecute good priests but cover up for bad bishops?
- How much has the GOA paid out in sex abuse settlements, and why won’t they make this figure public?
Source: The National Herald | By Theodore Kalmoukos
Met. Paisios’ Accuser Tells TNH His Story
ATHENS – In an exclusive interview with TNH, Spyros Malamatenios revealed new evidence against Metropolitan Paisios of Tyana, former Abbot of the Patriarchal Monastery of St. Irene Chrysovalantou in Astoria, including that he was also sexually abused by him at age 17. Malamatenios is the brother of Bishop Vekentios of Apameia, the Monastery’s former deputy abbot and Paisios’ coworker for more than forty years.
TNH called Paisios twice in Athens, where he has resided since October 2010 – having reached him on both his residence and cellular numbers, but he hung up the phone both times.
TNH File Photo In an exclusive interview with TNH, Spyros Malamatenios revealed new evidence against Metropolitan Paisios of Tyana, former Abbot of the Patriarchal Monastery of St. Irene Chrysovalantou in Astoria, including that he was also sexually abused by him at age 17. Malamatenios is the brother of Bishop Vekentios of Apameia, the Monastery’s former deputy abbot and Paisios’ coworker for more than forty years.
In his interview to TNH in December 2010, Vikentios had made the astonishing revelation that Paisios had sexually abused Malamatenios. He had stated that “while in exile in Greece for a month, I found out even my brother, Spyros Malamatenios, [was one of Paisios’ victims]. He revealed to me everything that had happened to him [since he came to America at 17]. Unfortunately, very bad experiences of sexual harassment by the abbot [is] why he had left after the death of my mother. He had disappeared, and I did not know where he had gone. [When I went to] Greece he told me that he was in Florida and did not want to see and hear anything about the Church and the clergy, nothing whatsoever.”
Malamatenios told TNH about shocking acts of lewdness in which clergy who now belong to the Greek Orthodox Archdiocese of America as well as from the Church of Greece had participated.
Malamatenios’ tragic misadventure began in 1979, when his [father] died in Greece and he and his mother moved to the United States to be close to Vikentios – who at the time was an Archimandrite with the Old Calanderist Church. “We lived at 36th Street and 23rd Avenue in Astoria where the offices are today. I was not close to the Church, but my brother, Vikentios, was very strict with me and he wanted me to go to confession to Paisios. He wanted him to be my spiritual father. I had never gone to confession before in my life. Little by little, Paisios approached me during the confession session and said that he wanted to be friends. We sat on the couch and he was drawing near me. Vikentios would go to bed upstairs and I was sitting down stairs in the living room watching TV. Paisios was telling me this is not wrong, that it is not unethical. He was persuasive in brainwashing [to sway you to] his ways.”
Malamatenios, who had been working in the fur business at the time, said that “the first sexual attack from Paisios was in the Spring of 1979. I resisted strongly in the beginning and I pushed him back,” but gradually, he gave in. The sexual activities were taking place in the living room, Malamatenios explained, because his brother slept upstairs and his mother across the hall. “Paisios pressed me to [comply] and threatened me no to say anything to my brother.”
Malamatenios said that other children younger than him were aware of what had happened, “but they did no talk because they knew I was Vikentios’ brother.”
Malamatenios added that a priest currently serving in the Archdiocese would bring young men around in their early to mid-twenties to Paisios, who would pay them to engage in sexual activities. He said that both Paisios and the other clergyman enjoyed watching. Paisios would also encourage him and other boys to have sex with 11 or 12 year-old girls, Malamatenios said. Though Malamatenios declined that prompting, other boys did not.
Malamatenios also recalled when an Archimandrite friend of Paisios had come to New York from Piraeus, and Paisios sent him, the other priest, Malamatenios ,and other boys to see a movie involving homosexual acts.
At some point Malamatenios had left New York. “I had gone to Florida to work because Paisios had become very pressing. I had left the Monastery other times as well, but Paisios made every effort to find me. He was in love with me.”
In 1997 Malamatenios returned to Greece permanently and for some years there was no communication between Paisios and him. Then, “Paisios found in Vikentios’ telephone book the telephone number of our aunt with whom we lived in the same apartment complex, he called and he invited me to go see him in Voula because Vikentios had sent some gifts for our relatives. I went to the apartment and Paisios made advances towards me. We became involved…and Paisios saw that I did not have a permanent job and he paid me…two to three hundred dollars each time that we engaged in …activities.”
Malamatenios added that the former nun Chrystonymphi Fitzpatrick “used to come to Athens and stay with Paisios at the apartment in Voula. I knew her since she was a little girl.”
Malamatenios said that “my life has been traumatized [and] that is why I couldn’t establish a family. My life was taken by Paisios; I did not expect these things to happen to me; I had lost my father, Paisios in the beginning was behaving in a friendly manner. He was telling me that we are friends [and] you can ask me anything you want, but finally everything turned upside down.”
Malamatenios explained that as a minor, he was impressionable and fell for Paisios’ advances, but the relationship that lasted until one and a half years ago was motivated by money – the two or three hundred dollars that Paisios would pay him each time.
He added that he became an atheist “because of the things that I have seen with Paisios and other clergy from everywhere, from Athens too. I know too much.”
More confirmation of the prophetic warnings for America from Paul Harvey:
This demonic corruption and shocking dereliction of sacramental duties by the Church hierarchy is an indication that something terribly dark and deadly has replaced Christ in the midst of these “leaders.” No Orthodox Christian person in his right mind with even an ounce of conscience and a modicum of morality and decency would have allowed such demons to continue to operate inside the Orthodox Church, let alone enable and protect them.
ALL bishops who had knowledge of this and did NOTHING must be held accountable.
I agree with you 100%.
Since Metropolitan Paisios of Tyana and Bishop Vikentios of Apameia are canonical, will they be invited to the Great and Holy Council too?
LOL! Jane you are a pip!
Jane Rachel inquires:
“Since Metropolitan Paisios of Tyana and Bishop Vikentios of Apameia are canonical, will they be invited to the Great and Holy Council too?”
I don’t know, really.
In view of a recent discussion on this blog site, however, they apparently will qualify for inclusion in a Trisagion for the Deceased.
I’m sure that it is necessary to actually be deceased in order to qualify for inclusion in Trisagion prayers for the deceased.
Sarcasm, Jason, sarcasm ((As when I ended one of my posts with “/s” meaning “end of sarcasm.”)
In this instance, Father Patrick did not have to indicate such because to do so would have been a lack of appreciation for the intelligence of his readers.
Hi, Father Patrick. It took a minute, but I get that.
I knew this priest who used to chant, “…and make his memory to be eternal.” So I asked him if it would be better to use either …”make his memory eternal,” or “…may his memory be eternal.” The priest scratched his head and looked puzzled but he didn’t change it. He probably still chants, “Make his memory to be eternal!”
“Make his memory eternal” or “may his memory be eternal” both make me think about theosis continuing even in our falling asleep/death, where God is actively and always making the soul of the departed servant eternally more like Himself. Or should I end that with ?
Paisios should be deposed. So should Vikentios. They should be deposed from the episcopate and reduced to the status of laymen. Suspending them is not enough. Neither is having them apologise in front of the entire Patriarchal Synod.
The sheer vileness of these actions is sickening. There are no words.
I fear that if there are clergy of the Archdiocese who’ve participated in the sexual abuse of the young with Paisios, they will never be punished with the punishments due them. Only if there are lawsuits a la Katinas will anything happen.
They’ve already been deposed. Scroll down below.
The young man says he “fell for Paisios’ advances”… I feel he needn’t have any idea in his head whatsoever that he did anything wrong, for he was the victim entirely. He was actually too young to know what to do, except try to find a way to survive. His life was in danger. Fight was impossible. Flight was impossible. Freeze was the only option. If he feels perhaps he might have been able to resist, somehow, he needn’t feel that way. He is brave to come forward, and needn’t go back in his mind and wonder what he might have done to prevent it, as if he should have or could have resisted, but didn’t. He also needn’t blame himself for his actions later, when he got older, nor for his loss of his faith. It’s ALL on the predators’ heads, all the responsibility for what these victimized young folks have to go through is on them. What he describes is exactly how these monsters operate. When you are preyed upon you get sucked into the predator’s clutches like a helpless dragonfly sucked into a spider’s web. The scene that comes to mind is Frodo getting caught by Shelob. I just needed to say that.
It’s good to read all the articles George posted under “Bishops Behaving Badly“. It’s a serious situation.
At 17 years old you are old enough to know right from wrong. At 17 years old I knew what i was doing and who i would give myself to. My son is 3 years old and will not allow anyone to walk into the bathroom when he is in there. He knows that the only one allowed to see him naked are his parents and the doctor only if mommy or daddy are there.
At 17 years old you are old enough to know right from wrong. At that age I knew what i was doing and who i would give myself to. My son is 3 years old and will not allow anyone to walk into the bathroom when he is using it or has to use it. He knows that no one is supposed to touch or go near him except for his parents and the doctor only if mommy or daddy are there.
Good point Anonymous, however the initial repors said that the teenage in question was mentally retarded. Hopefully we’ll no more when this goes to trial.
Who are we talking about Spyros? Because I can assure you he was not retarded and was in a long relationship with a close friend of mine and hung out in my home.
It makes no difference. These creeps who paraded as clergy were wrong and there is no justification for it. Even if it was consenting. Once you are ordained, you are to be celibate. If you can’t be chaste then you should be chased out of the ranks of the clergy. Period. There is no hair-splitting.
The moment these men dishonored their priestly vows, they deposed themselves. Now it is just up to the Church to codify their deposition.
George, please keep us up to date on this awful story so that we can all learn from it. I think that it also serves as a warning to anyone thinking of entering the ranks of the clergy but have immoral sexual habits, keep moving on! WE DON’T WANT YOU. Work out your salvation in some other capacity in the Church but not as clerics.
Jacob, I understand what you are saying and i agree. But we really don’t know the truth just yet. It is unfair to put a label on someone when they have not been legally found guilty. Remember these are just words/ gossip floating through the Greek media from certain people who are trying to get $$$ from the church. I personally know both priests…. Vikentios I never cared for… Everyone knew that one day he would be the destruction of Paisios because of his jealousy… He was mean, rude, condescending & very judgmental. Paisios I have nothing bad to say accept that he was maybe a little to greedy when it came to money. Then again which priest isn’t….? As far as all the other stuff w/ Paisios i will not think twice… Myself and my three siblings grew up in St.Irene and i had two brothers who were alter boys starting in the mid 70’s. There were about 20 families who were close w/ the church and Paisios NEVER< EVER crossed any lines w/ any of the parents or children… I remember being in the basement where Paisios would be sitting on a chair w/ his feet up on another molding candles with his hands for the church. All the kids would be laughing because he had holes under his shoes.
Anonymous, I hope you are right about Met. Paisios.
I also have first-hand memories about a much-loved bishop, now reposed, and how the children would flock around him and he would tell them jokes. They loved him. And yet, almost unbelievably, similar things to what has been alleged about Met. Paisios have also been alleged about him. I’m not trying to be coy, but I am cynical and a bit jaded.
The lord be with him and everyone else involved….
Just because you and your family were not victims does not mean he is not a predator who victimized others. And, there can be no consent to this kind of thing when there is a power differential between the abuser and abused–just like teacher/student, therapist/patient no matter how old the victim is.
Gigi2, I am not only talking about my family…. There are about150-200 of us (maybe more) who were very close to Met. Paisios and the church. We all have the same feelings and pray that the truth comes out very soon… Again these are just alegations not facts…
I didn’t realize he was seventeen until I read the article more closely and by then it was too late to edit the comment.
The Orthodox leader, if guilty, is still guilty regardless of what the teenager did. The young man, if it happened, is still a mess.
Ever notice how some folks who are members of the omogenia always seem to get a ticket to Greece just the the US Authorities investigation moves forward. The same was true for that priest from Cyrpus. I think its also a very valid question to ask who is supporting these two financially right now. I agree justice must be done but I also wonder if these two have “knowledge” that they may leverage to their own advantage.
It’s a lot like how Bishop Demetri (Khoury)’s retirement lasted a few years, then he got a nice trip to Mexico.
To be fair to Bp Demetri, his foundational problem is alcoholism. He was/is not a pedophile nor do I believe that he was predatory–just stupidly drunk in the worst of all places. He was prosecuted and removed from his post and required to register as a sex offender in Ohio. Big difference from the current case. Obviously trying to return him to active public ministry anywhere is not the best idea but please don’t lump him in with serial predatory pedophiles.
Also in fairness to Bp Dmitri Khoury, he is a diabetic as well. The jitteriness that can be brought by an extremely low blood sugar (80) is often very much like a sugar rush and can p;lay havoc with the mind.
His Grace Bishop Demitri is living in quiet retirement in a modest house in Maimi. He does not serve. He spends his time writing and translating works on Orthodoxy. He is a good and pious man who has an illness and is working to overcome it. He deserves our prayers and support not our condemnation.
Archpriest John W. Morris
Amen.
Father John, no one, least of all me, is condemning him. The only thing I’m condemning is the attempt others made to interfere with his healing.
Your charitable sensibility is moving, Helga. One often has occasion to note it.
So, THAT’s what “got a nice trip to Mexico” means.! Who wudda thought?
Actually refreshing to see a bishop who prefers women. Why we need married bishops.
Diogenes considers, “Actually refreshing to see a bishop who prefers women. Why we need married bishops.”
Those bishops would be chosen from the ranks of married priests.
No thanks.
And why should marriage exclude one from consideration for bishop?
Logan 46 asks, “And why should marriage exclude one from consideration for bishop?”
Answer. Marriage does not exclude one from consideration for bishop.
For starters, Metropolitans Platon, Theophilus, and Leonty were all married. Very recently, Bishop Boris, whom EVER-memorable Archbishop Job succeeded after the short bungled and aborted administration of Bishop Mark Forsberg, was also married. Bishop Nikon was married.
St. Innocent (Veniaminov) was married. A parish priest, he volunteered to go to Alaska after all the eligible monastics refused to go.
When discussing this topic, it’s a good idea to remember the Borgias. Accomplished leaders with proved executive ability and no pedophilia on the side, either!
OTH, the circumstances have changed since the decisions of the Council in Trullo. There being no theological reason to the contrary, perhaps it is time to consider reintroducing the earlier practice. There may be a priest or two who feel the calling, their wives are amenable, and they are otherwise qualified.
Incidentally, the purported reason given in Trullo was that the public was scandalized that a bishop and his wife lived together (read had sex). I always wandered why the same public was never scandalized by married priests cohabitating (and having sex) with their wives.
How sad all of this is! How dark and wearisome!
Do we know if either Pope John Paul II, or Benedict XVI ever recalled a priest or bishop accused under similar circumstances and relocated him in a similar manner?
It is at least some consolation that both Paisios and Vikentios have been deposed from the episcopate (and the priesthood) and reduced in rank to simple monks.
To put things in perspective, the same has not happened in the Catholic Church, where predator-bishops were merely removed from their dioceses and exiled to monasteries or retirement homes but never “laicized”.
http://byztex.blogspot.com/2012/03/ep-deposes-2-bishops-over-ny-monastery.html
I don’t know how the law works at the EP, but I was under the impression that clergy would normally have to be found guilty in a criminal court before being defrocked. I guess the fact that the brother was willing to go public to the papers didn’t leave Patriarch Bartholomew and His Synod with any other choice. No matter what the brother’s personal motive was, all I can say is thank God he spoke up and saved others from abuse.
The reason why Spyros left is because his brother Vikentios sent him away. He was embarrassed about what he was doing and the person he was. He was selling drugs, doing drugs and stole from the church. He ran with the local Greek thugs who’s parent’s were worshipers at the church. His story is exactly that a story… He and his brother are suing the church for millions.
This is what I don’t understand. He is living off of welfare in NY but he is planning to buy a house if he hasn’t already…. Which he is planning to build a new church and turn back to being an old calenderist because he is no longer with the EP ….
In the US according to what I’ve heard Paisios name is clear from everything. He has not been found guilty in any court. He has no labels as sex predator or pedophile.
The Christian thing to do is not judge anyone and nothing bad should come out of our mouths.
fact) The real reason Spyro left is because Vikentios made him go. He was embarrassed by what his brother was doing. He was a drug dealer, drug addict, he stole from the church and ran with the local Greek thugs who’s parents attended St. Irene. He was in trouble with the authorities and Vikentios made him leave.
Vikentios is living NY off the welfare system. But has plans on purchasing a house if he has not already done so and building his own church. He is becoming an old calenderist again because he is no longer with the EP. He is suing the church for Millions…
Paisios has not been found guilty of anything in any court. He has no outstanding warrants and has not been labeled as sex predator or pedophile.
If we are all Christians then we should not be gossiping and nothing bad should be coming out of our mouths… Just leave it in Gods hands… My Mother use to say O Theos argi alla then lizmoni…. and in the end the truth will come out.
When I was around 16 years old I was a lonely kid without many friends, and was befriended by a 30 year old guy who was working as a pipe organ builder. I became his assistant and we had to travel out of town frequently. He gradually molested me (alcohol helped a lot). He was never ‘invasive’ but still I felt ashamed and at the same time liked working on the instruments with him. So there was attraction and at the same time repulsion. I finally quit after about a year, but it has stayed with me ever since. ( I’m now in my 70s). Incidentally, he soon after went to seminary and became an Episcopalian priest.
I can understand how a priest or other authority figure can beguile an impressionable youth to do things that normally wouldn’t happen. I hope Spyros can eventually overcome what happened to him.
Jim of Olym
Vikentios, Former Bishop of Apamea plans to sue the Patriarchate of
Constantinople
03.04.2012 11:05
Source: Sedmitsa.Ru
NEW YORK. In an interview with the National Herald,
the former bishop of Apamea Vikentios said he did not recognize the decision of
the
Holy Synod of the Orthodox Church of Constantinople of March 28, 2012, deposing
him and downgrading him to the category of monks. He intends to file lawsuits in
U.S. courts, and Turkey, as well as with the European
Court of Human Rights.
With regard to the former Metropolitan of
Tyana Paisios, whose assistant he had been, Vikentios wished him a sincere
repentance,
recognition of his guilt and the courage to apologize to his victims among
the Greek diaspora United States, report “Amen” and “Romfea.”
oops he forgot mention his lawsuit against St Irene… The master mind behind the scheme that blew up in his face…
My family was one of the first supporters of st irene
My grandfather had done a lot of work as well as the hole family
They instowed blind faith
I was a victom of paisios in the the 70s
I was also a was an alterboy single parent no father.
My heart was torn when many years ago found the strength inside to come foward and seeing nothing had been done I distanced myself a lot of soul surching and self distruction actions.untill I took a stance to do what’s right from my heart many cotacts to the people who listend.many years ago.
So, the Orthodox finally figure out for themselves after a generation of GOC corruption that the demonic is in structural and systemic control of their hierarchy and church. They have yet to figure out that the laity has allowed this to go on for decades. Maybe in another generation the GOC laity will figure out that they are responsible for the moral and ethical behavior of their church. That is, if they survive the loss of their hemorrhaging youth that they cannot attract or retain.
The youth of your church is your future and the Orthodox could care less about them by how they unethically and immorally think and behave in modernity. It is your witness and your witness is your relevancy. You have neither in the real world of church growth by way of mission and evangelism based in transparency, accountability and integrity. Rational thinking in freedom and that thinks for itself can clearly see this in the real world where such things really matter.
The Orthodox hate two things, rational and modernity. They hate them because the represent change that the Orthodox cannot make without loosing their sick power and control. In effect, and by their outcome, the Orthodox prove they are anti modernity and anti rational. Therefore, they are experiencing a archaic failure and irrational outcome. They are experiencing an ANTI outcome and not a PRO outcome. The modern world expects ethics and morality in structure and system and it expects you to live up to who you claim to be or face the consequences of being exposed as hypocrites and that only leads to IRRELEVANCY.
Gods only alone right and one true church the GOC is corrupt, failed, irrelevant and dying. The outcome proves your claim of being who you claim to be in comparison to all other churches not of you? In the real rational world of modernity it does. People match your claim to your thinking, attitude and behavior and make decisions to come into the church or not come into the church. Your claim being relevant to you does not make it relevant to anyone outside of you unless your church lives as Christ lives.
The safe church is the true church of Jesus Christ. What you got Orthodox? You got a tradition based dead religion gone corrupt without solution. Your church life is its tradition and church life is to be Jesus Christ resurrected, alive and celebrated by your WITNESS to watching western world that thinks rationally and therefore does not believe in your church just because you tell the world you are Gods only true church and salvation. You have to live out your salvation in freedom of religion open system America and where the closed system church/state was thrown out centuries ago. Get it?
If the Orthodox want to become relevant to our modernity world they are going to have see a paradigm shift of thinking, attitudes and behavior. Since the tradition based Orthodox cannot change by and through tradition nothing is going to change and therefore your future relevancy and viability is highly predictable. It is as predictable as is your future morality and ethics that are degrading with each passing day.
The most interesting aspect of all of this to me is how POWERLESS and PATHETIC the laity is made by the centralized religious power and control totalism church. I find it fascinating that the very problem is staring all of you in the face and at the same time the very problem staring all of you in the face is denied to be the problem.
The Orthodox do not live in the Christian integrity world of transparency and accountability. Without integrity you have only shame and failure. The Orthodox live in a state of shame. They do not live in a state of victory in Christ Jesus our Lord. God is about victory over shame from the Garden forward. To not be of that is being of Satan who shames and takes you BACKWARDS. The Orthodox do not live in Jesus Christ centered victory. They live in Satan centered shame and shaming. The EOC is not Christ based. It is SHAME based. I see in your posts continually and without end. You can deny it, but that does not make your shamed and shaming state any less than true by the outcome of your church that proves to be SHAME brought upon all of YOU.
Jesus warned us about the danger of making tradition an idol not seen by the idolators as an idol. The last person to see the idol is the idolator. Idols do not want change away from their being made idolatry. They loose power and control by change. If your church is based upon centralized top down power and control in tradition it will not change and that means it will die. It is only a matter of time before it simply drifts off into insignificant irrelevancy and that is not Jesus Christ in the Gospels.
Have any of you NOTICED the drift of your church off into insignificant irrelevancy? Do you have a sense of SHAME about this corrupt and failed state that claims to be Gods only true church and salvation? Does your powerlessness to stop the corrupt failure of the EOC cause you to be shamed by that truth? Is the FUTURE of your church shame or victory over shame in Jesus Christ?
Shame goes right to the worth, value and significance of each church member. It is either based in shame or in victory over shame. You can tell which one a church is basically centered upon by its OUTCOME. The more victorious a church is at defeating shame the more spiritually mature, alive and growing is that church. Your salvation determines your worth, value and significance and you can see how real that is to a church by its outcome in the real world. The Orthodox sense of worth, value and significance to God is seen in its outcome in modernity and it is glaringly obvious. You do not operate like Sons of the Lord Jesus Christ. You operate like shame based and defeated by Satan powerless wimps. Carnal corrupt to your very cores is this debacle of Christ by the Orthodox failure in modernity.
The informed modernity and mature Christian can see right through your church to the cause of its corrupt failure that has no solution what-so-ever. Tradition cannot defeat shame. Only the Christ of transforming change can defeat shame.
Orthodox, how does a tradition basis of church lead such a church into a shame basis that has no solution? I know how it does. Do any of you? Yes, I know, I ask questions that not a one of even considers to ask yourselves. It’s just too open system to think for yourselves in this way.
Oh, BTW, shame is a closed system and Christ worth, value and significance is an open system. Do you know why it is this way by God? The EOC is a closed system by it closing itself off to God and that closing off to God creates a huge shame basis that replaces God at the center of your church. Shame is a defeated church that lives in a continual and never ending state of failure without solution. That is Satan’s character witnessed in your midst and denied. Satan wants all of you in shame based and defeated denial. He will even deceive you into using shame as a solution to shame and you will never see it coming for being shame based. Shame is CIRCULAR WITHOUT SOLUTION when shame is used as the solution.
Orthodox, is your EOC finding solution or is it found in a state of circular without solution?
GOC, is your hierarchy treating you with victory in Christ or with SHAME?
Now, like good shame based powerless pawns deny this is your shame state by the outcome of your church seen in the real world. Shame loves to deny that it is shamed or shaming. I mean, how could Gods only alone right and one true church be based in shame? That’s just to diabolical to even consider, right? The tradition based church would never ever allow tradition to be turned into SHAME like the Sanhedrin did, right? They would never allow shame based tradition to stop their church dead, right?
The Orthodox live in a state of shame. That is the state of the failed in their carnality and it is their bondage denied. There is simply no way you do not have a great sense of SHAME by the obvious outcome of your church. Shame in evil or victory in good is your Orthodox choice and the Orthodox have obviously made their choice by how the outcome tells us what choices they made.
Evil is shame and SHAMES.
Christ is victory and defeats SHAME.
Which one is your EOC?
Victory over shame is Christ. Living under the control of shame is Satan. A corrupt, failed, irrelevant and dying church is experiencing victory over shame? A church that cannot solve its ethical and moral problems in a reasonable time frame is Christ’s victory over the pornographic acts of church sexualization inside of your church? Tough love is not an Orthodox strong point and nor is confrontation. That is why your church sees Christ’s love as being a corrupt church or all of you would CHANGE that outcome of church. Your outcome is how you spiritually see and think about GOD. You can all talk about the shocking facts observed in the corruptions, but talk is not going to change one thing.
Talk is powerlessness. Action is God. Circular without solution is Satan. Solution is God. The world sees who the true Orthodox God is by their real world outcome. Oh, yes, it does too. Only a shame based fool would deny that fact.
Yes, I know, all of this against you and not for you. It has to be against you since it did not come from within Gods only alone right and one true church. No one outside of you can see into you better than any of you can and that is why your church is experiencing victory and not shame, right? The Orthodox by their truth claim are the most objective Christians on the planet. Just look at their outcome and tell me different.
I ask the Orthodox questions they never think to ask themselves. I think for myself and do not allow a top down and highly centralized structure and system of shame based power and control corruption think for me. I might as well let Satan of shame and shaming be my thinking if that be the case.
Orthodox, keep bowing to shame and corruption every time it shows up to parish or cathedral to offer you its blessings. Bow to the idol of centralized religious dictatorship power and control that does nothing but shame you and bring shame upon your church. Let it be your Christian mind and not Christ and then measure the outcome of your thinking to determine if it is of Christ’s victory or Satan’s shame. Your real world outcome matters unless you are shame based. If you are shame based you are apathetic and indifferent carnal corrupt and your church will thoroughly reflect that state by its outcome.
The victorious in Christ refuse to be shamed by the corrupt. The shame based allow the corrupt to shame them. Victorious warriors for Christ are not defeated wimps of shame. Warrior church of mission and evangelism or enabling codependent wimp church of defeated shame. That is the Orthodox choice made and seen in the real world of MODERNITY Christianity. The Orthodox reject modernity and any form of Christianity that is not based in their shame based traditions. Period.
Shame enables sexual corruption and the shaming practices of pedophiles. Shame destroys the worth, value and significance of Christians that are sexually abused by a SEXUALIZED church. Shame CLOSES the already closed system of the EOC and what is closed keeps the Gospel closed. Shame closes the Gospel and then it kills a church dead. That is the EOC today and the EOC today denies this is its true state. This is the true state of what calls itself Gods only alone right and one true church and salvation. Your SALVATION is SHAME and that is your outcome seen.
How a church thinks determines its outcome. Shame is the EOC outcome. I promise that it is and all of my promises to the Orthodox come true. All of them.
Ashley Nevins
Oh God. Here we go again.
“Talk is powerlessness. Action is God. Circular without solution is Satan. Solution is God. The world sees who the true Orthodox God is by their real world outcome. Oh, yes, it does too. Only a shame based fool would deny that fact. ”
So what sect are you trying to convert us to so we can compare results, or are you just trying to convert us to the Gospel according to Ashley Nevins? I converted to Orthodoxy due to Orthodoxy having a real world outcome and history of actions and results to get away from all the bad fruit of Protestantism.
I see a lot of discussion about “consent,” here, and I’m not sure how that’s relevant. Inviteing someone who is competent to consent to engage in a homosexual act, is to invite that person to sin
People don’t ” make up” abuse. Why would they? The abused usually blame themselves first. Abusers are people who were most likely abused themselves. A law of social work is ” don’t blame the victims”. Where does it begin? Where does it end?
Compassion is always appropriate, but full investigations and evidence are necessary before you convict anyone of sexual assault.
False allegations are difficult to comprehend, leading some to call it the “Lie that just happens” … But we know these things do happen.
If you follow the news you’ll frequently hear of false accusations of rape, sometimes even false confessions. The Brian Banks story is just one recent one that comes to mind.
I know of several cases just in my personal experience. I could make some generalizations, but the likely motives and psychological explanations vary.
Forgiveness and repentance go hand in hand.